Over at Google Groups, very clever people have ported Ice Cream Sandwich to x-86 platforms. From the generic port, there are offshoots specific to a variety of netbooks (the Asus EEE, others including my machine, the Lenovo S10-3t).
Lots 'o fun. Wifi, PIM syncing, and the Dolphin browser is impressive. Android flies on a netbook and it made for good enough practice that I soon switched to an Android phone, which I also really like.
http://groups.google.com/group/android- ... 4bbef2021d
While the posts themselves are informative, Google Groups utterly sucks. Sluggish, poor searches, the usual Google approach to things.
But the work done deserves applause.
Jake
Other Distros
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Colonel Panic
- Posts: 2171
- Joined: Sat 16 Sep 2006, 11:09
Re: Android x-86 Port
Agreed, this is amazing! Perhaps this is the answer for people with very old computers.jakfish wrote:Over at Google Groups, very clever people have ported Ice Cream Sandwich to x-86 platforms. From the generic port, there are offshoots specific to a variety of netbooks (the Asus EEE, others including my machine, the Lenovo S10-3t).
Lots 'o fun. Wifi, PIM syncing, and the Dolphin browser is impressive. Android flies on a netbook and it made for good enough practice that I soon switched to an Android phone, which I also really like.
http://groups.google.com/group/android- ... 4bbef2021d
While the posts themselves are informative, Google Groups utterly sucks. Sluggish, poor searches, the usual Google approach to things.
But the work done deserves applause.
Jake
Gigabyte M68MT-52P motherboard, AMD Athlon II X4 630, 5.8 GB of DDR3 RAM and a 250 GB Hitachi hard drive running Ubuntu 16.04.6, MX-19.2, Peppermint 10, PCLinuxOS 20.02, LXLE 18.04.3, Pardus 19.2, exGENT 200119, Bionic Pup 8.0 and Xenial CE 7.5 XL.
nooby, Android is not really Linux. I like to call Android the "inbred third cousin of Linux" because the way it works does not make much sense to me.
It does have, as its core, a Linux kernel. However, everything on top of that, everything that is added to that, is Java and, as such, must be interpreted at runtime.
A bit more info on that... there are basically two kinds of programming language, that which is compiled and that which is interpreted. The distinction is really a matter of "when".
Compiling, in programming jargon/lingo/phraseology refers to a particular action of transformation. If you write programming ("code" in programmer slang) in, say, C++, you have a little problem with executing that code -- it is not a language that any piece of discrete hardware actually can use, natively. So it must be translated into what is called 'assembly language', 'assembly code', or 'machine code' -- binary (10101101) represented usually as hexadecimal ("hex") pairs with a 0x prefix (0x9A216D = 10101101).
If you compile your code (this is how C++ tends to work) then it is compiled once, and you have a 'binary' or 'executable' that you can run basically whenever you want to. Interpreted code, however, does not form an executable file -- it instead remains source code until execution is ordered. It only gets compiled when it runs, but it must compile each and every time it runs. This is how Java works, by design.
So Android is very strange, because almost all of its functionality depends on interpreted code that must be compiled at each runtime -- and certainly not all at once! This is why (at least, as far as I can tell) it needs tremendous processor power and RAM space to work with, and why lower-power ARM tablets (such as the under-$100 Chinese ones all over eBay) are horridly slow.
On the other hand, there is a tremendous benefit to this, and I'm pretty sure that this one feature is why Google made Android the way they did. Once you have a kernel and some small interpreter on top of it, you don't have to worry about what hardware is underneath. Android can run on literally almost anything because the Java-interpretation method allows user programs and interfaces to completely ignore what hardware is underneath -- everything becomes a simple question of computing "horsepower". One does not have to design for this processor vs. that processor (which is very good, because ARM systems tend to have extreme hardware differences) -- just code a program for Android, and it will run in Android.
This brings to mind a term I like to use sometimes, "kludge". I'm told it's properly spelled "kluge" and pronounced "klooj" but I tend to pronounce it "kluhj". I'm American. We do a lot of things wrong around here, why make any exceptions?
"Kludge", as I use it, is a synonym of "jerry-rig" or "jury-rig" (I've never been able to pin down the proper spelling). That is to say, an apparently hazardous and seemingly poorly-thought-out solution to a problem, usually using scrap and spare materials that are readily at hand. (Such as using a Pringles can and duct tape for car engine repairs, like this.)
One might consider Android to be an "elegant kludge" (normally a severe contradiction in terms). That is: it works wonderfully, with few undesirable side effects, but for all the wrong reasons.
It does have, as its core, a Linux kernel. However, everything on top of that, everything that is added to that, is Java and, as such, must be interpreted at runtime.
A bit more info on that... there are basically two kinds of programming language, that which is compiled and that which is interpreted. The distinction is really a matter of "when".
Compiling, in programming jargon/lingo/phraseology refers to a particular action of transformation. If you write programming ("code" in programmer slang) in, say, C++, you have a little problem with executing that code -- it is not a language that any piece of discrete hardware actually can use, natively. So it must be translated into what is called 'assembly language', 'assembly code', or 'machine code' -- binary (10101101) represented usually as hexadecimal ("hex") pairs with a 0x prefix (0x9A216D = 10101101).
If you compile your code (this is how C++ tends to work) then it is compiled once, and you have a 'binary' or 'executable' that you can run basically whenever you want to. Interpreted code, however, does not form an executable file -- it instead remains source code until execution is ordered. It only gets compiled when it runs, but it must compile each and every time it runs. This is how Java works, by design.
So Android is very strange, because almost all of its functionality depends on interpreted code that must be compiled at each runtime -- and certainly not all at once! This is why (at least, as far as I can tell) it needs tremendous processor power and RAM space to work with, and why lower-power ARM tablets (such as the under-$100 Chinese ones all over eBay) are horridly slow.
On the other hand, there is a tremendous benefit to this, and I'm pretty sure that this one feature is why Google made Android the way they did. Once you have a kernel and some small interpreter on top of it, you don't have to worry about what hardware is underneath. Android can run on literally almost anything because the Java-interpretation method allows user programs and interfaces to completely ignore what hardware is underneath -- everything becomes a simple question of computing "horsepower". One does not have to design for this processor vs. that processor (which is very good, because ARM systems tend to have extreme hardware differences) -- just code a program for Android, and it will run in Android.
This brings to mind a term I like to use sometimes, "kludge". I'm told it's properly spelled "kluge" and pronounced "klooj" but I tend to pronounce it "kluhj". I'm American. We do a lot of things wrong around here, why make any exceptions?
"Kludge", as I use it, is a synonym of "jerry-rig" or "jury-rig" (I've never been able to pin down the proper spelling). That is to say, an apparently hazardous and seemingly poorly-thought-out solution to a problem, usually using scrap and spare materials that are readily at hand. (Such as using a Pringles can and duct tape for car engine repairs, like this.)One might consider Android to be an "elegant kludge" (normally a severe contradiction in terms). That is: it works wonderfully, with few undesirable side effects, but for all the wrong reasons.
starhawk, that where wonderfully put.
Oh so it is that much interpreted. Oups not good.
But does that not mean that if one are able to
get puppy to work on ARM tablets or those
PC-on-a-stick and Mini-TV or whatever they
are named Mele 1000 and MK802 and all of them
then puppy would fly fast on them not being interpreted?
I will give up on Android indeed I am not on that level
Thanks for brightening my day here. Big friendly smile!
Oh so it is that much interpreted. Oups not good.
But does that not mean that if one are able to
get puppy to work on ARM tablets or those
PC-on-a-stick and Mini-TV or whatever they
are named Mele 1000 and MK802 and all of them
then puppy would fly fast on them not being interpreted?
I will give up on Android indeed I am not on that level
Thanks for brightening my day here. Big friendly smile!
I use Google Search on Puppy Forum
not an ideal solution though
not an ideal solution though
I'll actually be receiving one of those "stick systems", as I've come to call them, sometime next week. I traded for it on another forum.
Probably it will wind up running Bodhi or similar. I have neither patience nor skill for the kind of work it would take to get Puppy on that thing, although if someone is interested in trying to walk me through it, I will not object.
The specific model headed towards me is a CX-01 "Android Cloud Stick" containing a Telechips TCC8925 SoC and a Mali-400 GPU. There is an open-source driver for the GPU here, but I don't think it's been ported to that specific CPU yet, so I may be SOL (s*** out of luck) here.
More info on that particular device here --> http://www.cnx-software.com/2012/06/14/ ... cortex-a5/
Probably it will wind up running Bodhi or similar. I have neither patience nor skill for the kind of work it would take to get Puppy on that thing, although if someone is interested in trying to walk me through it, I will not object.
The specific model headed towards me is a CX-01 "Android Cloud Stick" containing a Telechips TCC8925 SoC and a Mali-400 GPU. There is an open-source driver for the GPU here, but I don't think it's been ported to that specific CPU yet, so I may be SOL (s*** out of luck) here.
More info on that particular device here --> http://www.cnx-software.com/2012/06/14/ ... cortex-a5/
Android is bootable on USBHDD NTFS partition with grub4dos. Sound & internet connection have no problem.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=alYvE-l9 ... e=youtu.be
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=alYvE-l9 ... e=youtu.be
True, but Android-x86 setup is pretty basic and if you choose the ntfs drive (that has Windows, etc), there's a good chance you'll wipe the ntfs.
I've installed to an ext2 usb drive, then moved the installed directories (usb will still need grub to boot) to ntfs, and that'll give what you say, but no root, which is where all the fun is
So I installed to sd card, class 10. Running an installed Android x-86 on USB is maddeningly slow and can cause crashes on setup.
Jake
I've installed to an ext2 usb drive, then moved the installed directories (usb will still need grub to boot) to ntfs, and that'll give what you say, but no root, which is where all the fun is
So I installed to sd card, class 10. Running an installed Android x-86 on USB is maddeningly slow and can cause crashes on setup.
Jake
Latest DSL 4.11rc......... still great on older hardware.
http://www.damnsmalllinux.org/
http://www.damnsmalllinux.org/
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Colonel Panic
- Posts: 2171
- Joined: Sat 16 Sep 2006, 11:09
Yeah, it's great to see a distro as old as DSL making a comeback.starhawk wrote:Hey, except for the text style, particularly in the bottom tray (what Windows people call the Taskbar...), that actually looks --dare I say it-- nice!
Also: must... have... wallpaper... aargh!
James, I thought CrunchBang was a great distro except aesthetically it's a bit on the "dark and stark" side for my taste. It works really well and is economical on system resources.
Gigabyte M68MT-52P motherboard, AMD Athlon II X4 630, 5.8 GB of DDR3 RAM and a 250 GB Hitachi hard drive running Ubuntu 16.04.6, MX-19.2, Peppermint 10, PCLinuxOS 20.02, LXLE 18.04.3, Pardus 19.2, exGENT 200119, Bionic Pup 8.0 and Xenial CE 7.5 XL.
Hey,..James C wrote:Latest DSL 4.11rc......... still great on older hardware.
http://www.damnsmalllinux.org/
that really does look nice, don't it? Very different than what DSL used to look like. But I just now put Racy Puppy (dual-booted with w2k Pro Lite) on my old computer .....HP Vectra HP--PIII--933Mhz--512mb ram--20G & 40G hd(s).
I was very surprised at how well Racy Puppy worked on this old machine.....so guess I won't need to try DSL on it. BTW,..it continuouly never stops amazing me at how well these older (but goodie) computers still work so well with the right operating systems. And to think that folks actually just dump them into the garbage to run and buy the latest and greatest. What a waste,...eh?
PS: I slapped on an old CD of "Ace of BASE" and Puppy was tearing it up big time (I mean in a VERY good way). So let all the rest of the folks run to spend their hard-earned cash to buy the latest and greatest,..............when some of us can slap on a Puppy and do it all anyhow. (and all on a tiny "shoestring" budget.).
I tried to boot DSL using same code as I bootJames C wrote:
Latest DSL 4.11rc......... still great on older hardware.
http://www.damnsmalllinux.org/
Knoppix but it failed to boot on NTFS inner HD.
Maybe it only boot from CD or USB?
What code should one use grub4dos? menu.lst
is this one okay?
title dsl
root (hd0,1)
kernel (hd0,1)/dsl/boot/isolinux/linux24 fromhd=/dev/sda2 knoppix_dir=dsl/KNOPPIX ramdisk_size=100000 apm=power-off vga=791 nousb nomce loglevel=0
xkeyboard=us
initrd (hd0,1)/dsl/boot/isolinux/minirt.gz
savedefault
boot
What should I take out of add to it?
I use Google Search on Puppy Forum
not an ideal solution though
not an ideal solution though
hi, d4p,
Initially, what I did was do a full install to an empty usb stick, ext2-formatted.
Then I moved the directory called android-4.0-rc2 to my c: drive (ssd). I left the other files on the usb, and I think I played with grub or menu.lst so it would find the new directory on the ntfs drive, but it may have found it on its own upon boot--can't remember. As you know, boot searches the android-4.0-rc2 directory and grabs the first one it finds.
It'll work, and it's certainly faster than the live deal or from the full-install usb.
But I lost root, which meant no cpu overclocking, system file stuff, etc.
So I did a full install on a class 10 sd card, ext2-formatted. That flies, it's anedotally as fast as an NTFS install.
Jake
Initially, what I did was do a full install to an empty usb stick, ext2-formatted.
Then I moved the directory called android-4.0-rc2 to my c: drive (ssd). I left the other files on the usb, and I think I played with grub or menu.lst so it would find the new directory on the ntfs drive, but it may have found it on its own upon boot--can't remember. As you know, boot searches the android-4.0-rc2 directory and grabs the first one it finds.
It'll work, and it's certainly faster than the live deal or from the full-install usb.
But I lost root, which meant no cpu overclocking, system file stuff, etc.
So I did a full install on a class 10 sd card, ext2-formatted. That flies, it's anedotally as fast as an NTFS install.
Jake
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Colonel Panic
- Posts: 2171
- Joined: Sat 16 Sep 2006, 11:09
That's brilliant! Racy is supposedly for newer computers only but I found it worked just fine on my 11 year old Compaq.nitehawk wrote:Hey,..James C wrote:Latest DSL 4.11rc......... still great on older hardware.
http://www.damnsmalllinux.org/
that really does look nice, don't it? Very different than what DSL used to look like. But I just now put Racy Puppy (dual-booted with w2k Pro Lite) on my old computer .....HP Vectra HP--PIII--933Mhz--512mb ram--20G & 40G hd(s).
I was very surprised at how well Racy Puppy worked on this old machine.....so guess I won't need to try DSL on it. BTW,..it continuously never stops amazing me at how well these older (but goodie) computers still work so well with the right operating systems. And to think that folks actually just dump them into the garbage to run and buy the latest and greatest. What a waste,...eh?
PS: I slapped on an old CD of "Ace of BASE" and Puppy was tearing it up big time (I mean in a VERY good way). So let all the rest of the folks run to spend their hard-earned cash to buy the latest and greatest,..............when some of us can slap on a Puppy and do it all anyhow. (and all on a tiny "shoestring" budget.).
As you say, why buy new hardware when the old works just fine with Puppy?
- CP
P.S. Have to admit I;m not familiar with "Ace of Base" but will check it out soon
Gigabyte M68MT-52P motherboard, AMD Athlon II X4 630, 5.8 GB of DDR3 RAM and a 250 GB Hitachi hard drive running Ubuntu 16.04.6, MX-19.2, Peppermint 10, PCLinuxOS 20.02, LXLE 18.04.3, Pardus 19.2, exGENT 200119, Bionic Pup 8.0 and Xenial CE 7.5 XL.