(old)Puppy Linux Discussion Forum

2XL wrote:I respectfully disagree with the OP.
Personally, the PC will never die for me.

The PC will not "die" for many people. The issue has to do with numbers of devices.
All one has to do is extrapolate, using history. Supercomputers, Mainframes, Servers (used to be Minicomputers), Desktop, Laptops...
What's next? TABLETS.
The PC will remain at its level in the hierarchy, but the number of tablets will dwarf the number of PCs around. Real soon. You don't believe it? Just take a look at how many PCs there are around vs. the number of mainframes. That will give you a clue.
The sheer variety of tablet devices will also be impressive. X86, AMD, ARM, screen sizes, "transformers", pocket, etc...
As far as puppy goes... that depends on what the developers feel like doing.
Cheers!

ilanrab wrote:

2XL wrote:I respectfully disagree with the OP.
Personally, the PC will never die for me.

The PC will not "die" for many people. The issue has to do with numbers of devices.
All one has to do is extrapolate, using history. Supercomputers, Mainframes, Servers (used to be Minicomputers), Desktop, Laptops...
What's next? TABLETS.
The PC will remain at its level in the hierarchy, but the number of tablets will dwarf the number of PCs around. Real soon. You don't believe it? Just take a look at how many PCs there are around vs. the number of mainframes. That will give you a clue.
The sheer variety of tablet devices will also be impressive. X86, AMD, ARM, screen sizes, "transformers", pocket, etc...
As far as puppy goes... that depends on what the developers feel like doing.
Cheers!

if an affordable x86 tablet with say a 8 - 10" screen is released then you could pretty much run normal puppy on it, maybe with whatever needs to be installed to use the touchscreen.

if there is ever a virtual keyboard that uses some touchscreen aware ncurses or something so you can use it at the console not in a X session then this would be so awesome.

if there is ever a virtual keyboard that uses some touchscreen aware ncurses or something so you can use it at the console not in a X session then this would be so awesome.

Have a look at touchcal...it is in need of support/development

http://touchcal.sourceforge.net/

see also http://www.ibm.com/developerworks/linux ... layscreen/

Else, ask someone who does bacon/python to 'knock something up'

Aitch

Consumer Electronics Association Says Devices Getting Simpler

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000142 ... 12052.html

Thin and light computers will also be a big attraction, he said, alongside the tablet computers that were the talk of last year's show.

sickgut wrote:if an affordable x86 tablet with say a 8 - 10" screen is released then you could pretty much run normal puppy on it, maybe with whatever needs to be installed to use the touchscreen.

I am actualy old enough to have used an old 'portable' Mac SE30 with it's built-in 9 inch b/w screen as my personal machine - I still have the carrying bag, while my IIsi business machine had a huge 12" monitor with 8-bit color. Those were the times, no need to go back there!

If we talk about the future for puppylinux, I really don't see the point in having a tablet, with a tiny 8-9" screen, as your only computer, unless the following criteria is met: you're young, you have perfect eyesight, you only use it for facebook, twitter or other social media, to do a quick lookup with a browser and to maintain your addressbook; i.e. manage your social life - if a virtual life is a life at all, that is... (yeah, yeah, I'm probably just an old fart) All of those things you can also do with a smartphone, and then you can take pics too.

I can see why people only having a big, static desktop PC want to have a tiny. portable extra machine for mobility. At the same time, it would be very interesting to know, at what point the user of a tablet, or similar tiny gadget, would want to use a desktop PC?

Unfortunately, I think that only the existing puppy users/fans will care if any of these gadgets run puppylinux. I have a feeling that the puppy community is too small to develop fancy applications/apps fast enough for anyone to bother, and the majority of tablet users will probably not want something else than a mainstream OS running on their tablet.

I have observed the trends over the last years, where laptops and tablets/pads, smartphones and cameras kind of overlap each other, and I guess we will continue to see some very creative development within those segments, that will erase the borders between them even faster. But if we look at a similar development in cameras, you still have the pro photographers dragging around those massive SLRs with a 2 foot tele lens, despite all the new tiny mega-zoom cameras popping up every hour, bristling with functions you'll never use.
There will still be a need for tools for all segments, and as long as you need to use a PC as a tool for daily work or research, I think there will be desktop machines in some form around, probably with some fancy 3-D screen, and other not-yet-thought-of gizmos attached, and also some ordinary laptops. They will all be perfect for running puppylinux - as we know it today - as well.

The present battery technology is the major brake in the development of machine technology. Any new, smart battery technology will turn the whole business upside down in seconds, and make this discussion obsolete immediately!

If I knew how the personal PCgadget market would evolve, I'd be filthy rich, but I can see the possible need to develop a puppy based on - or integrating with - any language running on all tiny phones/machines. I think they will continue developing separately - and much faster - than the languages and systems used in any major OS. That will probably also demand that puppylinux move into a new software developer position, rather than mainly adapting/shrinking existing software, as is done today. That may limit the number of puppys offered to that market segment, and the competition will be tough. There are a lot of brilliant kids out there, already working on the next generation gadgets.

But then again, I know that all speculations in future trends in this field over the years, have proven to be just that; speculations!

I just realized that my little 2¢ turned into a novel, sorry 'bout that!

tallboy

If x86 tablets where produced, even with a 7" screen BUT it also has a monitor port (alot of tablets have hdmi) and USB, then you dont have to worry about the small screen if you plug into a monitor, and you can use your normal mouse and keyboard with it.

If x86 tablets where produced, even with a 7" screen BUT it also has a monitor port (alot of tablets have hdmi) and USB, then you dont have to worry about the small screen if you plug into a monitor, and you can use your normal mouse and keyboard with it.

I agree, but if your only computer is a tablet, you don't have a normal mouse, keyboard and monitor, do you?

Seriously, yes, that is an excellent solution, I did not intend to be disrespectful, sickgut. But with that solution, I feel that we are referring to only one of the user groups I described, those who already has a desktop PC or two as their main tool, and only uses a tablet for small tasks, because of the mobility aspect. If my hands and fingers were smaller, and my vision 20-20, I would be in that group myself, along with the majority of puppy users, I guess. I have some old laptops without working batteries, to prove it!

I fear that those who use a tablet only, are probably not aware of the existence of puppylinux at all, and to catch them, a puppy will have to be spectacular!

I also think many companies will develop simple solutions for sale and service specifically for tablets, as an example there are already specially designed pads used by most transporters and mailmen, to get an electronic confirmation for making a delivery in time. As the prices will fall, the tablet will be a resonably priced tool, perhaps better covering some of the functions put into a relatively expencive pad, or a phone app, today. There are also schools here in Norway letting pupils pay a small fee to rent a tablet, after 3 years they own it. (No standing screen on a laptop to hide behind - a teacher's dream!) The major problem we face then, is the same as for the dominance of MS today, a company or institution will demand one OS only to run on their tablets, probably licenced to the one with most developers around...

At least until the new, sensational 3D puppyboard© comes along, eventually...

Tallboy

sickgut wrote:

ilanrab wrote:

2XL wrote:I respectfully disagree with the OP.
Personally, the PC will never die for me.

The PC will not "die" for many people. The issue has to do with numbers of devices.
All one has to do is extrapolate, using history. Supercomputers, Mainframes, Servers (used to be Minicomputers), Desktop, Laptops...
What's next? TABLETS

if an affordable x86 tablet with say a 8 - 10" screen is released then you could pretty much run normal puppy on it, maybe with whatever needs to be installed to use the touchscreen.

That issue has to do with the Wintel monopoly.
When the two companies decide that they want to compete in the mid to low end tablet market, then there will be wintel x86 tablets at the right price. It's a question of "when", not a question of "if".

Tallboy
There are many X86, core2duo/Atom powered tablets on the market which will run puppy, and I've seen video of touchscreen working too, so we won't get totally missed out, until Parm or similar is developed by Puppy devs

Look at the Eros 2, or Apple knockoff, for example, or these

http://www.eweek.com/c/a/Desktops-and-N ... DF-439051/

hdmi ports bring SOPA regulation/DRM control into their hands...beware!

http://puppylinux.info/topic/another-re ... -streaming

Aitch

Hi,
The Raspberry Pi credit-card sized Linux PC is out as of today.
Looks like we have another Linux PC to play with?

I have started another thread about the Raspberry Pi at this address:

http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=76404

Here are the references to the Raspberry Pi announcement:

http://www.engadget.com/2012/02/29/rasp ... now-25-mo/

http://www.cultofmac.com/149445/raspber ... w-on-sale/

Edit: here's more:

http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/news/201 ... ry-pis.ars

I live on a mountain, in a really tiny village, where the road was only built 50 odd years ago, and 10 years ago we got ADSL! Yes, and now it's up to 2 Mb/sec, which is not Cloud worthy. And I'm exagerating slightly there, it's usually about half that
In the winter the phone line goes down, so there's no ADSL, or any thing else, for that matter.

I have BIG hard drives, with my music, films, audiobooks, books, info and loads of other stuff on them. It's the only way I can have access to media.
I'm not the only person who doesn't live in a town, or even near one, and for me PC's are essential. They will be for a long time too, as progress here isn't fast.
But I don't care, as I enjoy putting my PC's together. It's one of my great pleasures in life.

Apart from big PC's or ARM, there's also Raspberrypi, which is tiny, but x86 arch. It's a real progress. If I don't have electricity (yes, that goes down in storms too), I could use my Raspi, which is Puppy loving, with HDMI, as well as hard drive compat.

Don't give up on PC's and Puppy yet. Not every one is Cloud compatible, or even wants to be, for that matter.

starlyte, I totally agree!

Well, there is still hope for mankind, 'cause history has an eery way of repeating itself!

Take a look at this fantastic new gadget, The Impossible Instant Lab, which allow your instant iPhone pics to be instantly saved on POLAROID FILM!

Oh yeah! Like if a camera could do that? HAH!

tallboy

I'm with you, starlyte

Don't give up on PC's and Puppy yet. Not every one is Cloud compatible, or even wants to be, for that matter.

tallboy

Oh, that's rich!

The Impossible Instant Lab

Some people will never understand the value of older technologies. Today I rescued a beautiful sounding Baldwin concert grand out of UC Berkeley. I guess the choral director figured a nice digital piano would take up less space, so it couldn't be worth anything. Vinyl records have made a nice comeback as well. There's many examples.

Here's an interesting new standard that could replace forums. Every distro needs to provide a MayDay button in the Menu/Help area. It's no longer truly "user friendly" without a group of devs standing by ready to assist (there's no good reason why a user should have to wait more than 15 seconds). In the old model, you don't really get to see who it is that is providing help. Those days are gone.

"During a Mayday session, in fact, you share control with the Amazon support person who turns up in a small onscreen window within 15 seconds of when you tap the Mayday button. Though you can see and hear the rep, he or she can hear but not see you.

What the rep can see, however, is precisely what you have on your screen, and can take over in real time to show you how to get things done on the device, or even do them on your behalf. The rep can also draw on the display to, for example, circle icons or buttons."

http://www.usatoday.com/story/tech/colu ... t/2858471/

Thanks for pointing this out, I'll try to avoid it.

Separately...

One can live in suburban USA and still find a near-identical situation. For example, CATV-dsl goes off during power-failures, and are quite over-subscribed. About 2 years ago we had a nasty surprise snow-storm in October that ruined Halloween. Power out 5 days here. Yet the telephone line still functioned. Having slow Phone-dsl (768K) kept me vey busy with neighbor requests, some for medications. PS... ya know that UPS device that powers your system (mine is netbook/router only) can also recharge cel-phone batteries. Another good reason to have a UPS for power backup.

Thorium