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 Forum index » Off-Topic Area » Security
internet without cookies or javascript or flashplayer
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Stripe

Joined: 23 Jun 2010
Posts: 658
Location: In a field. England

PostPosted: Wed 07 Sep 2011, 01:05    Post subject:  internet without cookies or javascript or flashplayer
Subject description: is it possible?
 

hi all

as an experiment I am going to try using the internet without flashplayer, cookies blocked and javascript turned off in the browser

the first problem I have found is finding a free email provider that will work without javascript or cookies

I tried setting one up myself using a server that would also act as a email server but no emails could be sent to any of the major email providers, they just returned them without reason.

I have found a provider that will work but it displays adds on their free accounts (and I dont want to use adblocker in case they can track its signiture)

any ideas?
don
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nooby

Joined: 29 Jun 2008
Posts: 10557
Location: SwedenEurope

PostPosted: Wed 07 Sep 2011, 05:06    Post subject:  

Quote:

the first problem I have found is finding a free email provider that will work without javascript or cookies


Is that webmail or pop3 or imap4 you talk about?

Fastmail.fm ? owned by Opera browser company now. Do them need such too?

https://www.fastmail.fm/
what browser did you use for this test?

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jamesbond

Joined: 26 Feb 2007
Posts: 2154
Location: The Blue Marble

PostPosted: Wed 07 Sep 2011, 05:36    Post subject: Re: internet without cookies or javascript or flashplayer
Subject description: is it possible?
 

Stripe wrote:
I tried setting one up myself using a server that would also act as a email server but no emails could be sent to any of the major email providers, they just returned them without reason.
Make sure you have your reverse DNS set up properly. Most mail servers these days will reject a mail from an IP address that doesn't have a proper reverse DNS - for good reason.

Quote:
I have found a provider that will work but it displays adds on their free accounts (and I dont want to use adblocker in case they can track its signiture)
Very Happy Well, whaddya expect? Can't any something for nothing right? Most of those "free" services are usually funded by ads (Puppy not included).

As nooby said above - may be you're looking for POP3 or IMAP servers? Gmail (if you're not allergic to Google) has POP3/IMAP, gmx.de has POP3, and fastmail.com as mentioned by nooby also has IMAP. But I bet that all of them will have ads appended to the emails.

cheers!

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dogle

Joined: 11 Oct 2007
Posts: 331

PostPosted: Wed 07 Sep 2011, 07:08    Post subject:  

I dumped Phlashplayer a year or so ago, and really haven't missed it.

Surprised that, by implication, you've been running without cookies being blocked!

JavaScript seems a bit more difficult. Safe-mail.net used to offer free email accounts, without advertisements appended, which did not require JS - might be worth asking them. (They purport to be strong on security, so if they no longer do this that would seem to be a retrograde step).
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Stripe

Joined: 23 Jun 2010
Posts: 658
Location: In a field. England

PostPosted: Wed 07 Sep 2011, 11:07    Post subject:  

hi all

nooby I have gone with fastnet as I can access my emails without javascript or cookies, (but i needed another email address to activate the account) I am using seamonkey in slacko beta 2.

janesbond I was using smeserver via dyndns so that I could receive incoming traffic

dogle I normaly run accept cookies for session only so a restart of the browser clears all cookies, as well as better privacy for the flashplayer/lso cookies.

internet radio plays great, now I have two options for video, either to download them to hard drive using a seamonkey addon or see if vlc will stream them (I think it can play swf files)

cheers
stripe
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Bruce B


Joined: 18 May 2005
Posts: 11108
Location: The Peoples Republic of California

PostPosted: Mon 12 Sep 2011, 00:25    Post subject:  

Don,

There is a rule that a directory cannot hold a file and a directory of the same name. I'll explain in a bit how I've used this in the past.

Years ago, I found that some sites require cookies for this reason disabling cookies was inconvenient.

My experience comes from Netscape, but the same principles should hold true with today's Mozilla.

1) a directory cannot hold data as a file can, for example a directory called cookies.sqlite cannot hold data

2) data cannot be added to a read only file. You can set your Linux files read only with the chattr command.

A directory called cookies.sqlite would prevent the creation of a file called cookies.sqlite.

It seems to me that if the cookie permissions are set, a web site cannot tell that it is not successfully writing cookies. I think this is because it is reading and writing from cache.

I suggest you can use the information in this post to experiment and see if you can function as if cookies are enabled, yet have no cookies.

If it works, please write back, because I image others would be interested.


Bruce

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nooby

Joined: 29 Jun 2008
Posts: 10557
Location: SwedenEurope

PostPosted: Mon 12 Sep 2011, 03:00    Post subject:  

Quote:
A directory called cookies.sqlite would prevent the creation of a file called cookies.sqlite.

It seems to me that if the cookie permissions are set, a web site cannot tell that it is not successfully writing cookies. I think this is because it is reading and writing from cache.

I suggest you can use the information in this post to experiment and see if you can function as if cookies are enabled, yet have no cookies.

If it works, please write back, because I image others would be interested.


Yes please tell us if it worked. Very interesting.

Ooops forgot to ask. What about that HTML5 everybody talks about as
the solution to all the vulnerability and dependency on Adobe Flashplayer.
Them said html5 is the solution. is that still not available then?

Edit I have a vague memory that latest version of Chrome/Chromium does have HTML5 and maybe SeaMonkey? Not sure at all. Google knows?

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Last edited by nooby on Tue 13 Sep 2011, 06:28; edited 2 times in total
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Dave_G


Joined: 21 Jul 2011
Posts: 459

PostPosted: Mon 12 Sep 2011, 03:15    Post subject:  

I'm keen to know too.
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Stripe

Joined: 23 Jun 2010
Posts: 658
Location: In a field. England

PostPosted: Sun 18 Sep 2011, 19:12    Post subject:  

hi all

update: after trying bruces tip (thanks bruce) of replacing the file cookies.sqlite with a directory of the same name, when the browser was run it created a new file named cookies.sqlite and renamed the directory cookies.sqlite.bak (I think)

I am going to try altering the permissions next

cheers
don
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jpeps

Joined: 31 May 2008
Posts: 3220

PostPosted: Sun 18 Sep 2011, 22:09    Post subject:  

Neither of Bruce's ideas work. chattr only locks in permissions, so the file will still be written to in root. I tried providing a dir of the same name and running dillo; it went crazy and didn't load. Best idea I've come up with is to create a backup which gets automatically restored if any changes are made. If I want the changes, I just create a new backup before closing out.
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mcewanw

Joined: 16 Aug 2007
Posts: 2345
Location: New Zealand

PostPosted: Sun 18 Sep 2011, 23:02    Post subject:  

An alternative to making a directory called "cookies.sqlite", which seems to work as suggested, would be to replace the regular file cookies.lite with a symbolic link called cookies.lite pointing to /dev/null:

Code:

ln -s /dev/null cookies.sqlite


The same kind of 'trick' is commonly used to send log file messages to /dev/null

For example:

Code:

ln -s /dev/null /var/log/messages

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jpeps

Joined: 31 May 2008
Posts: 3220

PostPosted: Mon 19 Sep 2011, 00:21    Post subject:  

mcewanw wrote:
An alternative to making a directory called "cookies.sqlite", which seems to work as suggested, would be to replace the regular file cookies.lite with a symbolic link called cookies.lite pointing to /dev/null:


interesting idea...and kind of works. I tried, again with dillo, and it kept attempting to write the same cookie about a hundred times (loop).
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big_bass

Joined: 13 Aug 2007
Posts: 1747

PostPosted: Mon 19 Sep 2011, 11:37    Post subject:  

this is my hack for that problem use this to clean up the extra files from browsers wasting space and memory

*all those files get rebuilt again anyway when you restart the browser

run the free command before and after to see the savings


Joe


Code:



#!/bin/bash
# clean-browser-junk
# cleans firefox and seamonkey browser junk and frees memory also
# Joe Arose ..big_bass

rm -f /root/.mozilla/firefox/*.default/Cache/*
rm -f /root/.mozilla/firefox/*.default/cookies.sqlite
rm -f /root/.mozilla/firefox/*.default/cookies.sqlite-journal
rm -f /root/.mozilla/firefox/*.default/places.sqlite-journal
rm -f /root/.mozilla/firefox/*.default/sessionstore.js
rm -f  /root/.mozilla/firefox/*.default/places.sqlite

# do the same for seamonkey
rm -f /root/.mozilla/seamonkey/*.default/Cache/*
rm -f /root/.mozilla/seamonkey/*.default/cookies.sqlite
rm -f /root/.mozilla/seamonkey/*.default/cookies.sqlite-journal
rm -f /root/.mozilla/seamonkey/*.default/places.sqlite-journal
rm -f /root/.mozilla/seamonkey/*.default/sessionstore.json
rm -f  /root/.mozilla/seamonkey/*.default/places.sqlite
rm -f -r /root/.macromedia/*

sync
echo 3 | tee /proc/sys/vm/drop_caches

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jpeps

Joined: 31 May 2008
Posts: 3220

PostPosted: Mon 19 Sep 2011, 14:53    Post subject:  

big_bass wrote:
this is my hack for that problem use this to clean up the extra files from browsers wasting space and memory

*all those files get rebuilt again anyway when you restart the browser


..problem with just deleting, is that there are some cookies you want might want.
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nooby

Joined: 29 Jun 2008
Posts: 10557
Location: SwedenEurope

PostPosted: Mon 19 Sep 2011, 15:54    Post subject:  

Hope I don't derail too much. One solution to Flash should be to find alternatives and has not that been talked about a lot.

HTML 5 or something that should be able to give a similar experience but not use Flash files.

But I know too little but does them not say that latest Chromium or Chrome browser has tested to use HTML 5 so would that be something for you to look into.

I mean you could use sfs versions of Chrome and that way only use it when needed? To not have it in pupsave file at all.

Or do as Beem and others do. Place all such things on the /mnt/home outside of pupsave.

But I know too little to give advices.

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