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How to use mtPaint to make an image from two images?
Posted: Tue 13 Sep 2011, 06:09
by sunburnt
I want to place two images side by side ( or over under ) and make one image.
So it uses only one image posting here at murga-linux, easier to view.
It seems a simple thing to do, but mtPaint isn`t intuitive in it`s operation.
Scoured Google but no help doing this.
Do you use two layers? But I think I`ve done it before much easier than that.
Posted: Tue 13 Sep 2011, 07:05
by aarf
Easier to post the images an do it for you than tell you how. Earlier mtpaint was tricky. Now it is easier. Inkscape may be a try also.
Posted: Tue 13 Sep 2011, 07:24
by aarf
Try this open two instances of mtpaint with the seperate images in each. Then selection> all then edit> export to clipboard system. Then import into the next mtpaint instance. Will elaborate if need more clues. {Typing via phone.}
Posted: Tue 13 Sep 2011, 08:31
by sunburnt
You`re probably right, "Select All" works with the box thing,
but the "Export Clipboard to System" menu item is grayed out.
I`ve done this before, there`s probably a few ways to do it.
Posted: Tue 13 Sep 2011, 09:17
by aarf
Ok. after select all, you have to do an edit>copy before the edit>export.
can be done just did this in lupu529
Re: Use mtPaint to make an image from two images?
Posted: Tue 13 Sep 2011, 10:01
by wjaguar
sunburnt wrote:I want to place two images side by side ( or over under ) and make one image.
So it uses only one image posting here at murga-linux, easier to view.
It seems a simple thing to do, but mtPaint isn`t intuitive in it`s operation.
Load one image, copy it to clipboard, load another, use "Image->Resize canvas" to add space (at the bottom or at one side), and paste the clipboard into it.
What, exactly, "isn't intuitive" in this simple sequence?
Posted: Tue 13 Sep 2011, 10:44
by nooby
What, exactly, "isn't intuitive" in this simple sequence?
wjaguar, Everything is easy for clever people
Thanks for telling us. I have to try that one.
What I really need is to combine Man and a Horse so the mans body becomes the neck and head of the Horse. A kind of Centaur whatever.
Is that merging? I guess one have to clip out the arear where the neck and head are and then paste in the Man there somehow?
Posted: Tue 13 Sep 2011, 12:48
by vovchik
Dear wjaguar,
It works like a charm - as you said. Nekotoriye iz nas blagodarny....nekotoriye ne poymut.
. Zhyzn' takaya.
Thanks, vovchik
PS.Have a look at:
http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=70058. I did it just for fun.
Posted: Tue 13 Sep 2011, 19:58
by aarf
So far we have a consensus 4 out of 4 find it not intuitive. Still took me some minutes even with the correct instructions. And this is from computer savvy users. How do you think newbies will fare?
Posted: Tue 13 Sep 2011, 20:41
by jpeps
aarf wrote:So far we have a consensus 4 out of 4 find it not intuative. Still took me some minutes even with the correct instructions. And this is from computer savy users. How do you think newbies will fare?
Well how often do people need to juxtapose pictures?
Posted: Tue 13 Sep 2011, 21:04
by aarf
jpeps wrote:
Well how often do people need to juxtapose pictures?
5 out of 5. Often enough to forget in the interval.
Posted: Tue 13 Sep 2011, 21:25
by sunburnt
Many thanks to all the responders.
In another post I was just remarking how few docs. there are for so much.
Geee... I wonder why M$ Weeners dominates the world?
Linus Torvalds said:
Show me the code.
Posted: Tue 13 Sep 2011, 22:13
by jpeps
sunburnt wrote:Many thanks to all the responders.
In another post I was just remarking how few docs. there are for so much.
Geee... I wonder why M$ Weeners dominates the world?
Linus Torvalds said:
Show me the code.
An interesting survey would be how many users have ever tried "man" anything. I'm guessing very few. Google searches have taken their place.
Yesterday I was trying to figure out window placement options for xli which was in the manuals I had previously deleted.
man pages
Posted: Tue 13 Sep 2011, 22:36
by str4y
jpeps wrote:
Linus Torvalds said:
Show me the code.
An interesting survey would be how many users have ever tried "man" anything. I'm guessing very few. Google searches have taken their place.
Yesterday I was trying to figure out window placement options for xli which was in the manuals I had previously deleted.
Yes indeed, I was trained on the old-school mainframes and the "man" command, though it pulled up some dense reading, was a constant go-to. So when I started getting into Puppy, I was distraught to see that the tendency is to just ask Google (or linux.die.net, who
probably aren't as evil as Google) for everything, and not file a copy away for off-line usage (I'm very often not on the net.) Tttuuxxx posted a man.pet (which is hard to search for because it's such a small, common word and this forum is so sprawling) which did much toward recreating that old UNIX man page functionality. I'd always meant to work on it further, but scads of other projects cause constant procrastination in that regard..
Posted: Tue 13 Sep 2011, 23:41
by wjaguar
aarf wrote:So far we have a consensus 4 out of 4 find it not intuative. Still took me some minutes even with the correct instructions. And this is from computer savy users. How do you think newbies will fare?
If someone is willing to compile a FAQ on trivial use-cases of mtPaint, for those users who prefer googling to thinking, he is welcome to it. Myself, I only document the uses for which
I myself would have needed instruction, were I not the developer of the thing
and obvious things like using menu commands for precisely what their names suggest are, just as obviously, left out.
BTW, from real-world experience: most people are well capable of
quite amazing feats of understanding, if only there is a work to be done and no one around willing to do it for them.
-= With best regards, Dmitry Groshev, maintainer of mtPaint =-
Re: man pages
Posted: Wed 14 Sep 2011, 00:05
by jpeps
str4y wrote:jpeps wrote:
Linus Torvalds said:
Show me the code.
An interesting survey would be how many users have ever tried "man" anything. I'm guessing very few. Google searches have taken their place.
Yesterday I was trying to figure out window placement options for xli which was in the manuals I had previously deleted.
Yes indeed, I was trained on the old-school mainframes and the "man" command, though it pulled up some dense reading, was a constant go-to. So when I started getting into Puppy, I was distraught to see that the tendency is to just ask Google (or linux.die.net, who
probably aren't as evil as Google) for everything, and not file a copy away for off-line usage (I'm very often not on the net.) Tttuuxxx posted a man.pet (which is hard to search for because it's such a small, common word and this forum is so sprawling) which did much toward recreating that old UNIX man page functionality. I'd always meant to work on it further, but scads of other projects cause constant procrastination in that regard..
Lucid includes Barry's pman (linked to "man" ). "man xli" decompresses /usr/share/man/man1/xli.1.gz into /tmp where it reads xli_1.html using Dillo.
"man mtPaint" takes you to
http://mtpaint.sourceforge.net/, where you can click on documentation. MtPaint is very well documented. Did you know it does animations by viewing layers set apart at small time intervals?
The juxtaposition solution is actually very intuitive for someone who understands the program. Would you need a manual to know that you'd need a bigger canvas to paint another picture alongside the original? Other than that, it's just cut and paste.
Posted: Wed 14 Sep 2011, 00:51
by sunburnt
It was exactly as I expected, except needing to "Copy" to get "Export" enabled.
This puzzled me at first when I went to export what I had just highlighted.
More intuitive would be loading a second image after the first and positioning it,
the canvas auto. sizing after the second image is set in place.
Just expanding the canvas and loading the second image directly is good.
But this being simpler to understand and do, doesn`t mean MtPaint can be
easily made to do it. It may be a real nightmare getting this kind of usability.
It is a shame particularly for MtPaint that the Help is no help at all... ( removed )
What might be good for apps. would be to have it`s local docs, and then if the
local docs can`t be found because of space conscious distro. builders that
insist on removing them, it would show web page docs in the default browser.
These could then be downloaded directly and become the menu`s local docs.
Posted: Wed 14 Sep 2011, 08:22
by wjaguar
sunburnt wrote:It was exactly as I expected, except needing to "Copy" to get "Export" enabled.
This puzzled me at first when I went to export what I had just highlighted.
I consider it quite intuitive that export doesn't get enabled unless you have something to export.
I admit that some confusion does arise when people expect mtPaint to operate on "selections" like most everything else does - but mtPaint
does not have the very concept, having been designed that way by Mark Tyler, and I myself never do miss them. A selection frame in mtPaint is nothing but a frame, while the clipboard always contains what user
explicitly had placed there (this, BTW, is why mtPaint's clipboard is kept separate from the system clipboard, and only connects to it through import/export).
IOW, "selection-less" mode of operation is a
feature of mtPaint; in the next version of the handbook, I'll add into section 4 "The Selection Tool" an explanation of that, and of what differences in operation it does cause.
More intuitive would be loading a second image after the first and positioning it,the canvas auto. sizing after the second image is set in place.
I intend to implement auto-sizing sometime later, as an option for compositing layers. Maybe it would make sense to provide such an option for pasting as well - but positioning the paste area would be tricky, then, because mtPaint isn't designed to have dynamically resizing canvas, and without that, the outside part of clipboard image won't be visible anyway (just as it isn't now).
Just expanding the canvas and loading the second image directly is good.
And mtPaint has
"undoable loading" for precisely that reason. You can load an image, copy it to the clipboard, then
undo the load operation and proceed to paste the clipboard into the original image.
It is a shame particularly for MtPaint that the Help is no help at all... ( removed )
What might be good for apps. would be to have it`s local docs, and then if the local docs can`t be found because of space conscious distro. builders that insist on removing them, it would show web page docs in the default browser.
For mtPaint, it can be done quite easily; just create a file
/usr/doc/mtpaint/index.html or
/usr/share/doc/mtpaint/index.html containing this line:
Code: Select all
<meta HTTP-EQUIV="REFRESH" content="0; url=http://mtpaint.sourceforge.net/handbook/index.html">
Posted: Thu 15 Sep 2011, 01:44
by jpeps
wjaguar wrote:
For mtPaint, it can be done quite easily; just create a file
/usr/doc/mtpaint/index.html or
/usr/share/doc/mtpaint/index.html containing this line:
Code: Select all
<meta HTTP-EQUIV="REFRESH" content="0; url=http://mtpaint.sourceforge.net/handbook/index.html">
no need...it's already included. In lucid_5.2.5:
/usr/share/mtpaint/mtpaint_handbook-3.31/docs/index.html
They're in older versions as well, accessed with "man mtpaint"
Posted: Thu 15 Sep 2011, 03:00
by Flash
For what it's worth, in Puppy 2.4.5 when I click
Menu -> Help there is a listing for mtPaint which links to ///usr/share/doc/mtpaint.htm. When I click it, I get:
404 Not Found
No such file or directory.