Can i ask why puppylinux.info is closed? I thought there was alot of interest and alot of people have put time into makeing readable articles.... was it just a backup forum for when this was down? or was it not popular enough to continue with?
Alot of VPS providers dont like forums and almost all dont like irc traffic or even perfectly legal torrents downloaded from or served from your VPS.
Ive used 3 separate VPS plans that where similarly priced at $25 a year all went out of business before the term of my contract. Im using a VPS's from www.fusevps.com altho the service is awesome i wouldnt like to speculate if these guys will stay in business or not.
The thing is that places like Linode that have been around since day one are 10 times more expensive for half the specs. I would prefer to pay $5 a month than $50, even if it means that i need to move the site to another VPS when the company im using goes out of business.
puppylinux.info was closed Jan 14, reopened Jan 28, 2012
It's a sad news for me this morning, but I fully understand Raffy's decision.
I have always believed it's far better to act freely (freely as "it doesn't mean you should, just because you can") than to be restricted by merciless and freezed rules.
This is it what distinguish both this and puppylinux.info forums from other ones, and why I like them so much.
And I really think that people here and there (mostly they are the same people) are truly great and unique - sometimes I visit (as a guest) one film forum, which has rules and is moderated, and it's hard to find there a single thread WITHOUT personal attacks.
It's all up to us.
I only expressed my feelings, and all what I mean is: "That which doesn't kill us, only makes us stronger".
Thanks Raffy for maintaining that pleasant place. I hope it's not the end and we ALL will meet there again.
And thanks John for this forum.
PS. Thanks for taking care of scripts, Saintless
Greetings!
I have always believed it's far better to act freely (freely as "it doesn't mean you should, just because you can") than to be restricted by merciless and freezed rules.
This is it what distinguish both this and puppylinux.info forums from other ones, and why I like them so much.
And I really think that people here and there (mostly they are the same people) are truly great and unique - sometimes I visit (as a guest) one film forum, which has rules and is moderated, and it's hard to find there a single thread WITHOUT personal attacks.
It's all up to us.
I only expressed my feelings, and all what I mean is: "That which doesn't kill us, only makes us stronger".
Thanks Raffy for maintaining that pleasant place. I hope it's not the end and we ALL will meet there again.
And thanks John for this forum.
PS. Thanks for taking care of scripts, Saintless
Greetings!
[color=red][size=75][O]bdurate [R]ules [D]estroy [E]nthusiastic [R]ebels => [C]reative [H]umans [A]lways [O]pen [S]ource[/size][/color]
[b][color=green]Omnia mea mecum porto.[/color][/b]
[b][color=green]Omnia mea mecum porto.[/color][/b]
I also would like to see puppylinux.info be resurrected.
But hopefully I would want it to return to the forum I saw when it started.
That is without heated arguments, name calling, degrading countries and members.
If the Puppy Linux Speakers Corner was removed, it might also help to keep those spats from starting.
It does not have to have all the sections that this forum does.
But I guess what I am getting at is if opened back up, the one rule I would like is "Keep all discussions civil or you are gone. No exceptions for anyone."
There, I would have just made some enemies and trampled on Freedom of Speech according to some.
But there are forums that are made for discussions on country, politics, religion, etc. for those that are so inclined.
A Puppy forum does not need to cater to those types of discussions as it is in fact a Puppy forum for discussion of things relating to Puppy.
One thing that did bother me was that a new member had attempted to join just before the forum closed.
That new member was Lycos and if you would like to know a little more of him, just visit YouTube and do a search for his work.
He did a number of videos on using Puppy and even hinted that he was in the process of making a new Puppy version!
Nuff said by me.
What changes would you like to see in the event the help forum opened back up?
But hopefully I would want it to return to the forum I saw when it started.
That is without heated arguments, name calling, degrading countries and members.
If the Puppy Linux Speakers Corner was removed, it might also help to keep those spats from starting.
It does not have to have all the sections that this forum does.
But I guess what I am getting at is if opened back up, the one rule I would like is "Keep all discussions civil or you are gone. No exceptions for anyone."
There, I would have just made some enemies and trampled on Freedom of Speech according to some.
But there are forums that are made for discussions on country, politics, religion, etc. for those that are so inclined.
A Puppy forum does not need to cater to those types of discussions as it is in fact a Puppy forum for discussion of things relating to Puppy.
One thing that did bother me was that a new member had attempted to join just before the forum closed.
That new member was Lycos and if you would like to know a little more of him, just visit YouTube and do a search for his work.
He did a number of videos on using Puppy and even hinted that he was in the process of making a new Puppy version!
Nuff said by me.
What changes would you like to see in the event the help forum opened back up?
8-bit wrote:
You said it all 8-bit:
If you post something offensive or don't behave, your post gets deleted,
if it happens three times, you're out.
I have no doubt that some will jump on the free speech bandwagon but
the forum has rules and expected behaviour.
It's pretty much the same if you go visit someone at their home, respect
their rules and customs or don't visit.
Simple really.
I believe there should still be an off-topic area for general banter
and humor.
The admins being more strict.What changes would you like to see in the event the help forum opened back up?
You said it all 8-bit:
Why not implement a sort of three strikes and you're gone concept.Keep all discussions civil or you are gone. No exceptions for anyone
If you post something offensive or don't behave, your post gets deleted,
if it happens three times, you're out.
I have no doubt that some will jump on the free speech bandwagon but
the forum has rules and expected behaviour.
It's pretty much the same if you go visit someone at their home, respect
their rules and customs or don't visit.
Simple really.
I believe there should still be an off-topic area for general banter
and humor.
Confine discussion to Puppy derivatives and associated hardware and software issues. Take a stand against blatant thread drift which is as annoying to some of us as dogmatic expressions of nationalist/political/religious views. The worst culprits are usually the most boring contributors. Do not have an Off-Topic section .... that only encourages them! 
[b]Classic Opera 12.16 browser SFS package[/b] for Precise, Slacko, Racy, Wary, Lucid, etc available[url=http://terryphillips.org.uk/operasfs.htm]here[/url] :)
Thanks raffy for all your work
you did a great job setting everything up
And I agree with the temporary closing
to reorganize and clean things up for the better
And I will add helping others is the goal
if you aren't helping others you aren't on topic
be that by posting information
posting code or linking to packages or
offering detailed feedback that can be of some practical use
And a pre-screening of Administrators /mods
that are focused on the maintaining of the forum
and can do the job well
Disclaimer *no names were given or implied
peace brothers
Joe
you did a great job setting everything up
And I agree with the temporary closing
to reorganize and clean things up for the better
I agree 100%!I would agree "Keep all discussions civil or you are gone. No exceptions for anyone."
And I will add helping others is the goal
if you aren't helping others you aren't on topic
be that by posting information
posting code or linking to packages or
offering detailed feedback that can be of some practical use
And a pre-screening of Administrators /mods
that are focused on the maintaining of the forum
and can do the job well
Disclaimer *no names were given or implied
peace brothers
Joe
@kooliepup
What do you make of this one under section XII MISCELLANEOUS ?
Other then that they look pretty good.
Might just give them a trial run too for some projects I'm working on.
What do you make of this one under section XII MISCELLANEOUS ?
A bit broad isn't it?Having password-only, hidden, or restricted access pages (all Web
pages must be accessible to the Internet community at large).
Other then that they look pretty good.
Might just give them a trial run too for some projects I'm working on.
I don't have a problem with that.
You can have hidden-but-not-hidden directories that are not linked to anything, and only accessable to those in-the-know.
Or maybe that's what they are talking about.
We'll find out.
One thing I like about them is that by the time you have finished your registration, the site is operative.
Start FTPing yer stuff immediately.
I had mine fully set up in 10 mins.
I had it all ready to go and tested locally.
Easy peasy.
So far so good.
No complaints.
You can have hidden-but-not-hidden directories that are not linked to anything, and only accessable to those in-the-know.
Or maybe that's what they are talking about.
We'll find out.
One thing I like about them is that by the time you have finished your registration, the site is operative.
Start FTPing yer stuff immediately.
I had mine fully set up in 10 mins.
I had it all ready to go and tested locally.
Easy peasy.
So far so good.
No complaints.
When Murga Forum went down, it was the very best to open puppylinux.info. Raffy did. For us all.
When Murga Forum was available again, I think there happened something like a 'crisis of identity' (maybe not exactly the right term, please be lenient). Here in MF I was not often in the off-topic section, in puppylinux.info often. One reason could be the disproportional quantity of off-topic posts. Sometimes I thougt by myself that raffy's forum is the off-topic section from MF. I don't mean this disrespectful or derogative in any kind.
Saying "it's only because the 'recent events' " seems to be only the half of the truth (my guess).
I appreciate the attempts from raffy, trying to handle things better than here (as far as it is possible).
I also appreciate the attempts from aitch for this and all in all, I think he did a very good job. I belief that he spent a lot of time and energy by doing this. I think he made some small faults (no offence). But hey, it's so easy to say so, if not involved and looking back! He's not perfect. I'm not perfect. Anybody want to throw the first stone? (rhetorical question, and I'm really not interested in any new discussion about that or aitch or others or about these events!).
About the last sentence, I can take 2 different points of view. First, completely harmless words. Nothing to say against this. On the other side it's a phrase from the christian faith. Dangerous, anybody could feel hurt or insulted. So should it be allowed or should it be forbitten? For me, in this case, the context is more important than the phrase or the words.
Although we are living more and more in a digital world, I prefer a analog perception.
Between allowing everything and banning for one wrong word, there's a big range. Involved by a dispute, even very polite and helpful people can write harsh words (I saw it often enough). Therefore I prefer to warn people clearly before banning. Also to ban people temporarily could be an option. Banning shouldn't be done by the decision of only one Admin (if there are more than one). If banning, it should be posted, maybe also the reason.
To designate all Admins was good. Not because anybody did wrong but because different point of views and actions. There must be a consens.
I see it similar about closing the forum. I think it's need to think about the general way.
Do/did I like(d) puppylinux.info? Yes.
Do we 'really' need it? As long as MF is available, no (most people there are also here). But it could be a worth addition and it could grow.
Should there be an off topic section? I'm not sure. On one hand, no. If anybody wants to post off topic, he can do it in the off-topic section of the murga forum. On the other side, there was a disproportional quantity of off topic posts (meaning not sure about the reason).
I can't and I will not tell anybody what is right or wrong or what to do. It's all only my opinion and some thoughts.
Best regards
Rolf
When Murga Forum was available again, I think there happened something like a 'crisis of identity' (maybe not exactly the right term, please be lenient). Here in MF I was not often in the off-topic section, in puppylinux.info often. One reason could be the disproportional quantity of off-topic posts. Sometimes I thougt by myself that raffy's forum is the off-topic section from MF. I don't mean this disrespectful or derogative in any kind.
Saying "it's only because the 'recent events' " seems to be only the half of the truth (my guess).
I appreciate the attempts from raffy, trying to handle things better than here (as far as it is possible).
I also appreciate the attempts from aitch for this and all in all, I think he did a very good job. I belief that he spent a lot of time and energy by doing this. I think he made some small faults (no offence). But hey, it's so easy to say so, if not involved and looking back! He's not perfect. I'm not perfect. Anybody want to throw the first stone? (rhetorical question, and I'm really not interested in any new discussion about that or aitch or others or about these events!).
About the last sentence, I can take 2 different points of view. First, completely harmless words. Nothing to say against this. On the other side it's a phrase from the christian faith. Dangerous, anybody could feel hurt or insulted. So should it be allowed or should it be forbitten? For me, in this case, the context is more important than the phrase or the words.
Yes. No doubt. I think all or at least nearly all of us agree."Keep all discussions civil or you are gone. No exceptions for anyone."
Although we are living more and more in a digital world, I prefer a analog perception.
Between allowing everything and banning for one wrong word, there's a big range. Involved by a dispute, even very polite and helpful people can write harsh words (I saw it often enough). Therefore I prefer to warn people clearly before banning. Also to ban people temporarily could be an option. Banning shouldn't be done by the decision of only one Admin (if there are more than one). If banning, it should be posted, maybe also the reason.
To designate all Admins was good. Not because anybody did wrong but because different point of views and actions. There must be a consens.
I see it similar about closing the forum. I think it's need to think about the general way.
Do/did I like(d) puppylinux.info? Yes.
Do we 'really' need it? As long as MF is available, no (most people there are also here). But it could be a worth addition and it could grow.
Should there be an off topic section? I'm not sure. On one hand, no. If anybody wants to post off topic, he can do it in the off-topic section of the murga forum. On the other side, there was a disproportional quantity of off topic posts (meaning not sure about the reason).
I can't and I will not tell anybody what is right or wrong or what to do. It's all only my opinion and some thoughts.
Best regards
Rolf
Ich verwende "frugal", und das ist gut so. :wink:
Raspberry Pi without Puppy? No, thanks.
Raspberry Pi without Puppy? No, thanks.
Saintless/DaveG
I think you're right, as the log-in page has been removed, however anyone with a non-logged out php in their browser would still be able to post/edit - thanks for attempt, at least, at self-moderation....we did OK, until Akismet stopped us, but it did show cooperation working, with help from raffy
koolie, whether you know it or not, many people, including me, expressed a 'don't leave' view for you, where you left your notice of intention......in my freedom thread in speakers corner
I posted an olive branch offer to resolve our misunderstandings offsite, to JIm, possibly via email, however the thread got more off-topic posts than on
I posted a reminder of the purpose of the thread, but it was derailed by further comment, not all pleasant, which pushed it to the top of recent posts front page
I guess that motivated the closure, as raffy wasn't the only one to have had enough - I'd been reduced to tears more than once, and raffy and I had been discussing deletion posts by email, and via the offsite admin console
thanks raffy, for providing the alternate forum - as I said, "It was an experience!"
I had posted a full and unconditional apology to Jim and everyone for my part in the misunderstanding/fracas
The rest is history - can we move on without a post-mortem, please?
This will be my only comment about it, thanks
Edit: Rolf, thanks
Aitch
I think you're right, as the log-in page has been removed, however anyone with a non-logged out php in their browser would still be able to post/edit - thanks for attempt, at least, at self-moderation....we did OK, until Akismet stopped us, but it did show cooperation working, with help from raffy
koolie, whether you know it or not, many people, including me, expressed a 'don't leave' view for you, where you left your notice of intention......in my freedom thread in speakers corner
I posted an olive branch offer to resolve our misunderstandings offsite, to JIm, possibly via email, however the thread got more off-topic posts than on
I posted a reminder of the purpose of the thread, but it was derailed by further comment, not all pleasant, which pushed it to the top of recent posts front page
I guess that motivated the closure, as raffy wasn't the only one to have had enough - I'd been reduced to tears more than once, and raffy and I had been discussing deletion posts by email, and via the offsite admin console
thanks raffy, for providing the alternate forum - as I said, "It was an experience!"
I had posted a full and unconditional apology to Jim and everyone for my part in the misunderstanding/fracas
The rest is history - can we move on without a post-mortem, please?
This will be my only comment about it, thanks
Edit: Rolf, thanks
Aitch
Nice to see all of you wanting our village back
I hope we all have learned a lesson and the future of puppylinux.info will be different now.
Aitch, Jim3630, Dave_G, SFR and all - lets hope Raffy will take us back in the village (well I'm still there)
Take your time, Raffy. We will wait for your decision
Edit: Raffy, (when and if you have time) check this thread, please.
http://puppylinux.info/topic/pussy-linu ... ere/page/4
All my posts there are blocked as spam for day or two after I post them. Is there any chance to change that, because I like to post there all the useful information from this forum.
Thanks!
I hope we all have learned a lesson and the future of puppylinux.info will be different now.
Aitch, Jim3630, Dave_G, SFR and all - lets hope Raffy will take us back in the village (well I'm still there)
Take your time, Raffy. We will wait for your decision
Edit: Raffy, (when and if you have time) check this thread, please.
http://puppylinux.info/topic/pussy-linu ... ere/page/4
All my posts there are blocked as spam for day or two after I post them. Is there any chance to change that, because I like to post there all the useful information from this forum.
Thanks!
aitch
i have not received any emails from you off site.
aitch i have not received any offer from you to resolve our misunderstandings.
aitch you refuse to retract calling me a racist and that i called you and sage a racist, among other things.
aitch i asked you to at least stop making allegations against me the day puppylinux.info closed and you would not stop.
aitch i posted i would not right any more about this even given your position.
you did not respond and i do not want a repeat of what happened there.
aitch you said you were upset with me because i used your birthname instead of usename and i sincerely publicly apologized to you.
i posted a public apology to so many people who had expressed their grief. many people left posting their reasons. many people here now will feel grief, anger, hurt over this.
aitch obviously some members here feel the need for a post-mortem.
aitch i am sorry to see you continue this now here. i did not personally want a post-mortem of that over here.
aitch please pm or email me but do not bait me with posts like that.
aitch and all i am not going to post here again about this in the forum. i am not going to post a copy of your thread or any others here.
--------
have edited this so many times trying to tone down, pare it down, stick to facts. seems one person's facts is someone else opinion. this is my best effort.
i have not received any emails from you off site.
aitch i have not received any offer from you to resolve our misunderstandings.
aitch you refuse to retract calling me a racist and that i called you and sage a racist, among other things.
aitch i asked you to at least stop making allegations against me the day puppylinux.info closed and you would not stop.
aitch i posted i would not right any more about this even given your position.
you did not respond and i do not want a repeat of what happened there.
aitch you said you were upset with me because i used your birthname instead of usename and i sincerely publicly apologized to you.
i posted a public apology to so many people who had expressed their grief. many people left posting their reasons. many people here now will feel grief, anger, hurt over this.
aitch obviously some members here feel the need for a post-mortem.
aitch i am sorry to see you continue this now here. i did not personally want a post-mortem of that over here.
aitch please pm or email me but do not bait me with posts like that.
aitch and all i am not going to post here again about this in the forum. i am not going to post a copy of your thread or any others here.
--------
have edited this so many times trying to tone down, pare it down, stick to facts. seems one person's facts is someone else opinion. this is my best effort.
Last edited by jim3630 on Sun 15 Jan 2012, 20:09, edited 7 times in total.
I hope so tooNice to see all of you wanting our village back
I hope we all have learned a lesson and the future of puppylinux.info will be different now.
3.01 Fat Free / Fire Hydrant featherweight/ TXZ_pup / 431JP2012
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Peace and Justice are two sides of the same coin.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Peace and Justice are two sides of the same coin.
harii4 like your tag line. something i need work toward.harii4 wrote:I hope so tooNice to see all of you wanting our village back
I hope we all have learned a lesson and the future of puppylinux.info will be different now.
Last edited by jim3630 on Sun 15 Jan 2012, 20:10, edited 1 time in total.
Saintless, yes I would hope we learn too
but being a "seasoned" pessimist I doubt
we are able to learn how to avoid it in future.
I trust everybody involved felt they did the right thing.
So no chance to learn as I see it but it can be my lack of
finetuning using English that fail to get nuances in the texts.
I trust that all of us or at least a big majority of us
underestimate how incredibly difficult this is.
They even write academic books about how difficult
cooperation is.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/books/2001/fe ... ianreview4
Richard Sennett wrote a book that got published
2012 and the title is
One need to commit to listening in a way we are not used to.
One need to be skilled at doing it and that take deep
commitment and dedication to get good at it.
http://www.richardsennett.com/site/SENN ... ?pageid=40
The cool thing with that guy is that he is one of those that
most likely have been brought up with Political Correctness
and his parents and grandparents? where too.
All of them Socialists and Communists and dedicated to
solving discrimination and other social issues.
So if he tells us this is much more difficult than what PC
folks usually say then I trust it is difficult.
Here in Sweden the PC folks like my Commist Dad and
his friends say it is very easy. One just decide to show
solidarity with minorities and all will just work.
Sennett knows from his own practice that it is not like that.
Co-operation needs commitment to practice until
one can listen to others in a skilled way.
I doubt any of us have that skill now. I know I fail at it.
but being a "seasoned" pessimist I doubt
we are able to learn how to avoid it in future.
I trust everybody involved felt they did the right thing.
So no chance to learn as I see it but it can be my lack of
finetuning using English that fail to get nuances in the texts.
I trust that all of us or at least a big majority of us
underestimate how incredibly difficult this is.
They even write academic books about how difficult
cooperation is.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/books/2001/fe ... ianreview4
Richard Sennett wrote a book that got published
2012 and the title is
In it he says that cooperation needs skills of a craftsmen.Together: The Rituals, Pleasures, and
Politics of Cooperation
One need to commit to listening in a way we are not used to.
One need to be skilled at doing it and that take deep
commitment and dedication to get good at it.
http://www.richardsennett.com/site/SENN ... ?pageid=40
The cool thing with that guy is that he is one of those that
most likely have been brought up with Political Correctness
and his parents and grandparents? where too.
All of them Socialists and Communists and dedicated to
solving discrimination and other social issues.
So if he tells us this is much more difficult than what PC
folks usually say then I trust it is difficult.
Here in Sweden the PC folks like my Commist Dad and
his friends say it is very easy. One just decide to show
solidarity with minorities and all will just work.
Sennett knows from his own practice that it is not like that.
Co-operation needs commitment to practice until
one can listen to others in a skilled way.
I doubt any of us have that skill now. I know I fail at it.
I use Google Search on Puppy Forum
not an ideal solution though
not an ideal solution though
That was not a notice of intent.Aitch wrote: you left your notice of intention.
I am not a Prima Donna.
Does anyone have a copy of that page?
I am now interested to see what transpired after I left.
At the time, I didn't want to know.
Last edited by kooliepup on Mon 16 Jan 2012, 02:39, edited 1 time in total.
There's no place like 127.0.0.1
Dear jim3630,
have you ever joined one of those components of the United States of America?
Army
Navy
Air Force
Do you remember what you learn first when ever being send outside the USA as a soldier?
"You are an ambassador of the USA as soon as you leave conus in uniform!"
You are always asked to make friends! Regardless how bad they will ever speak about your country, the United States of America!
It ain't easy at all, I know.
Best Regards,
Feodor
have you ever joined one of those components of the United States of America?
Army
Navy
Air Force
Do you remember what you learn first when ever being send outside the USA as a soldier?
"You are an ambassador of the USA as soon as you leave conus in uniform!"
You are always asked to make friends! Regardless how bad they will ever speak about your country, the United States of America!
It ain't easy at all, I know.
Best Regards,
Feodor
FeodorFeodorF wrote:Dear jim3630,
have you ever joined one of those components of the United States of America?
Army
Navy
Air Force
Do you remember what you learn first when ever being send outside the USA as a soldier?
"You are an ambassador of the USA as soon as you leave conus in uniform!"
You are always asked to make friends! Regardless how bad they will ever speak about your country, the United States of America!
It ain't easy at all, I know.
Best Regards,
Feodor
thank you for your good will and reminder. there are a couple of other things mentioned usually in the same breath. i resigned my commission in 1989.