Slacko 5.4 - FINAL 2 Dec 2012

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01micko
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#631 Post by 01micko »

pemasu wrote:Bug fix to be carried to the woof ?
Hopefully!

Attached is what I'll be putting in Slacko-5.4 rc2. I have moved the call down to allow for responsible service scripts. (ie YASSM, network_roxapp)
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rc.shutdown.gz
This has the ntfs fix, goes in /etc/rc.d, try it if you like @ pfix=ram , save to an ntfs filesystem
(10.27 KiB) Downloaded 481 times
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rcrsn51
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#632 Post by rcrsn51 »

Here was my test procedure.

1. Booted off the Live CD. It found the sfs on the hard drive.

2. Selected all the defaults and immediately made a save file on an NTFS flash drive. There WAS a network connection, so I don't know how that's significant.

3. Rebooted. The save file was detected, followed by a kernel panic!

4. Repeated using "umount-FULL". No problems.

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01micko
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#633 Post by 01micko »

rcrsn51 wrote:Here was my test procedure.

1. Booted off the Live CD. It found the sfs on the hard drive.

2. Selected all the defaults and immediately made a save file on an NTFS flash drive. There WAS a network connection, so I don't know how that's significant.

3. Rebooted. The save file was detected, followed by a kernel panic!

4. Repeated using "umount-FULL". No problems.
So looks like the fix is good then..

BTW, we got a prompt woof fix :)
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rcrsn51
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#634 Post by rcrsn51 »

I repeated the procedure with both Wary 5.3 and Slacko 533 and got identical results. If I opened the bad save file from another Puppy, it was empty.

It's odd that when the save file is on an NTFS hard drive partition, it sometimes works.

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01micko
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#635 Post by 01micko »

rcrsn51 wrote:It's odd that when the save file is on an NTFS hard drive partition, it sometimes works.
My best explanation for this behaviour is that the buggy busybox umount isn't happy until it's found something it can unmount.

For example; more often than not if I'm testing on one of my other machines I'll connect with curl ftp to my main machine to get quick access to files I have edited and such. I was doing this testing shutdown scripts and wasn't getting the bug. So my best explanation for that was that busybox umount was unmounting the curlftpfs and then it was happy. I guess curlftpfs should be one of the umount arguments. I could reproduce the bug 100% of the time when I didn't connect. Took me awhile to figure that one out!

Still, that doesn't explain why it would sometimes work if you had a connection but definitely didn't mount anything over the network. Just a buggy busybox applet I guess.
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Q5sys
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#636 Post by Q5sys »

Perhaps an odd request... but is there anyway we can get the IRC client to assign default nicks like it did in the past (I think it assigned by hostname, it was something like pupuserc627d8 where the last 6 are a hex value).

Its getting really confusing in the freenode #puppylinux room, because people are assigned defualt names in numerical order.
It has happened more than once that we are helping someone who has the nick Spupuser1, and in the middle they've gotten disconnected. They rejoin soon enough but someone else has joined before them so that new person gets spupuser1 and the old person gets spupuser2.
All we see is the disconnect and reconnect. So we assume we are helping the same person. Unless we happen to look at the IP reconnect info in detail we dont realize there is a difference.

I've seen it happen a few times where we continue to assist the first person but since we are addressing them as spupuser1 (since thats what they were) we end up having a new person doing things to their system that might have nothing to do with them and could cause them issues if we are trying to work through a config issue with someone.

The way the old systems used to work the person could disconnect and rejoin within a short period of time and still have the same nick. This made help sessions in irc a bit eaiser to manager if a person has to be logging in and out.
I've seen this happen several times when people were trying to work out their x.org drivers and had to drop out of X and then back in and reconnect.

just a simple request. Is there a reason this was changed... or was it just something that happened to change without any thought or intention?

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#637 Post by tlchost »

[quote="Q5sys"

Its getting really confusing in the freenode #puppylinux room, because people are assigned defualt names in numerical order.[/quote]

That's why some of us suggest that a user with a "default" nick create a nick of their own.

Thom

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Q5sys
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#638 Post by Q5sys »

tlchost wrote:
Q5sys wrote:
Its getting really confusing in the freenode #puppylinux room, because people are assigned defualt names in numerical order.
That's why some of us suggest that a user with a "default" nick create a nick of their own.

Thom
I understand that, but when you are dealing with trying to help someone with very little computer skill do something, it's sometimes best not to futher confuse them by trying to walk them through how to register an irc nick and and configure their IRC client properly... which has nothing to do with the reason they came into the channel in the first place.
Yes I agree that someone who is going to be hanging out or will be around for a while should register a nick. But for a person just trying to get quick help on an immediate problem... they dont care about their nick... they just want to get their issue resolved.

Its a easy fix (I'd think) to go back to the old default nick system. And one that would help eliminate some confusion with new/inexperienced users when they come looking for help.

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01micko
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#639 Post by 01micko »

Q5sys

What is the limit of chars of a nick on IRC?

Here's what I can do:

Code: Select all

if [ -f $HOME/.xchat2/xchat.conf ];then
		sed -i -e "s|spupuser|slacko${HOSTNAME:5}|" \
				-e  "s|spupuser1|slacko${HOSTNAME:5}1|" \
				-e "s|spupuser2|slacko${HOSTNAME:5}2|" \
				$HOME/.xchat2/xchat.conf
  fi
If a user keeps the standard "puppypc12345" hostname (it's actually $RANDOM") then they would end up with slackopc12345, slackopc123451 and slackopc123452, all random of course except for the appended 1 and 2. That code can run once and only once in /usr/sbin/delayedrun.

It worked fine on the commandline and should in the script, I'll test when I do a build later tonight.

Ha... I'll just go on IRC and find out! (By the way, $HOSTNAME has a limit of 15 chars by convention)
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#640 Post by Q5sys »

01micko wrote:Q5sys

What is the limit of chars of a nick on IRC?
Not sure... depends on how the IRCD is configured. I've only messed around with unreal before... freenode uses ircd-seven... so I have no idea on nick limits. But Id guess 12~16 chars probably.

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Q5sys
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#641 Post by Q5sys »

oh wait there you are in the IRC now testing it. :P

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01micko
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#642 Post by 01micko »

Q5sys wrote:oh wait there you are in the IRC now testing it. :P
yep

anyway, I shortened it a bit, it's just "slacko${RANDOM}" .. now, so the max will be 12 chars.

Cheers
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rcrsn51
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#643 Post by rcrsn51 »

01micko wrote:BTW, we got a prompt woof fix :)
And it's in the new Precise service pack.

Hopefully, jades will confirm that it solves his problem in Slacko.

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#644 Post by Jades »

rcrsn51 wrote:Hopefully, jades will confirm that it solves his problem in Slacko.
I'll report back tomorrow once I've had a chance to test it, hopefully in the afternoon. Not my turn on the Pentium D today, and new puppies other than Wary haven't worked on the K6 for several months due to lack of cmov.

With regard to 01micko's comment about saving to NTFS being a bad idea, I do see the point but thought it would be a more common thing than it seems to be. The theory is that a user would be booting LiveCD with the pupsave on the hard drive as a way to try out Puppy without interfering with their existing Windows install. This is basically the situation with the Pentium D, which I share with my brother. I do have some saves on USB stick and my phone, but prefer to use the hard drive as it's quicker and also I don't need to remember where I left the stick I need this time.

My K6 machine does have an assortment of partitions on it, but that's my personal machine and I needed to partitiion the drive anyway since it was bigger than the size limit supported by Win98 (effectively 20GB) - the main aim with that machine was to play old games natively rather than messing about with DOSbox and the like.
Zhaan - AMD K6 2 500, 512MB RAM, ATI Rage 128 VR. Full install Wary 5.5 [url=http://tinyurl.com/dy66kh8]HardInfo Report[/url]
Merlin - Core i5-4590, 8GB RAM, Radeon R9 270X. Slacko 5.7.0

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#645 Post by Sage »

Several folks are reporting NTFS issues with different Puppies at this time. Not sure I subscribe to the above rationale. Testing these distros on a Windoze machine is a fine idea, but it doesn't strike me as logical to save alien OS files on there. If folks like what they see, there might be much better options. Top of the list has to be Gparted Wdoze into oblivion, it isn't difficult even for neophytes. My experience of a range of ages and abilities is that folks finishing with the devil's OS once and for all makes them ecstatically happy! Alternatives, esp. if the machine in question is shared, include second HDs which are dirt cheap on eBay for the size demands of Puppy, caddies, USB sticks (mentioned above), external HDs, other solutions also available. Most of Puppies' finest attributes can be had within modest confines. Why not another -[ oh, yes, older! ] - piece of hardware from the local boot sale, neighbour's spoilt kids, in the loft/garage/under the bed, for example. Just what is it that folks want to do that needs another Echelon in this world! Anyone living within range is welcome to select from my retinue of entirely suitable machines, gratis. Or I'll build to their spec. at cost.
Slackware is the oldest continuously supported open distro and defers to many of the classic tenets of the genre; Slacko provides best-of-breed in the compact distro kennel.
It seems to do games, videos & musak editing, which, although not its prime directive, would normally be accomplished on larger machines/distros, games consoles, studio sets and the like.
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#646 Post by Q5sys »

Sage wrote:Several folks are reporting NTFS issues with different Puppies at this time. Not sure I subscribe to the above rationale. Testing these distros on a Windoze machine is a fine idea, but it doesn't strike me as logical to save alien OS files on there. If folks like what they see, there might be much better options. Top of the list has to be Gparted Wdoze into oblivion, it isn't difficult even for neophytes. My experience of a range of ages and abilities is that folks finishing with the devil's OS once and for all makes them ecstatically happy! Alternatives, esp. if the machine in question is shared, include second HDs which are dirt cheap on eBay for the size demands of Puppy, caddies, USB sticks (mentioned above), external HDs, other solutions also available. Most of Puppies' finest attributes can be had within modest confines. Why not another -[ oh, yes, older! ] - piece of hardware from the local boot sale, neighbour's spoilt kids, in the loft/garage/under the bed, for example. Just what is it that folks want to do that needs another Echelon in this world! Anyone living within range is welcome to select from my retinue of entirely suitable machines, gratis. Or I'll build to their spec. at cost.
Slackware is the oldest continuously supported open distro and defers to many of the classic tenets of the genre; Slacko provides best-of-breed in the compact distro kennel.
It seems to do games, videos & musak editing, which, although not its prime directive, would normally be accomplished on larger machines/distros, games consoles, studio sets and the like.
Horses,courses.
Are people just saving their save files to a NTFS drive... or are they saving it to a drive that they use windows on? The reason I ask is that its possible windows (when running) is doing something with the safe file which is making it unreadable by puppy. Perhaps trying to move it when it tries to defrag, etc. If its just sitting on a dormant non OS ntfs drive, then the possible issues are different.
I've never saved a safe file to NTFS, so I cant answer either way.

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#647 Post by Sage »

..windows (when running) is doing something...
- reminds me of that (in)famous Gatesian quote "...even we don't understand how it works...", or words to that effect.
Time for world+dog to move on.

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#648 Post by ICPUG »

I am glad you have solved the ntfs problem but there is something I don't understand.

I use FAT Slacko which appeared AFTER Feb 2012. It is frugally installed on an NTFS hard drive with a save file in the same directory as the sfs files. I do not have a network.

According to previous discussion those without a network are supposed to get a problem all the time.

I had no problem creating the save file and I have no problem on reboot with icons gone.

Does the umount command not get executed in this configuration? If so that would explain why I have no problem. If the umount DOES get executed then why do I not have a problem?

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#649 Post by rcrsn51 »

ICPUG wrote:I had no problem creating the save file and I have no problem on reboot with icons gone.
In my tests here, the umount script was accidentally unmounting an NTFS partition.

In /etc/rc.d/rc.shutdown, this occurs on Line 225. However, on Line 436, Puppy starts to create a save file on a partition that is already mounted on $SMNTPT from /usr/sbin/shutdownconfig.

If that's an NTFS partition, it was unmounted on Line 225. Bad things are going to happen, assuming that I am reading this correctly.

Why it doesn't happen all the time is a mystery. Also, it should have been happening in previous 5.3 Puppies. But IIRC, jades had no problem in Slacko 533.

In my tests where the save file was on an NTFS flash drive, the problem occurred every time.

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#650 Post by Jades »

rcrsn51 wrote:Why it doesn't happen all the time is a mystery. Also, it should have been happening in previous 5.3 Puppies. But IIRC, jades had no problem in Slacko 533.
It's possible that 5.3.3 came out in the period when I didn't have a functioning hard drive on the Pentium D machine, so I wouldn't have been able to test it on an NTFS parition. I was mainly working off a USB stick. My current 5.3.3 saves are upgrades of ones from earlier versions. The only other 5.3x Puppy I've been testing from around that time was Wary, but that was on the K6 machine which doesn't have NTFS partitions on either of the drives (FAT32 Win98 parition, ext3 data partition and a couple of full installs on ext4).

I did manage to create functioning saves on some of the versions between 5.3.3 and 5.3.7.7 so I am a little confused - but that's probably normal for me when trying to test Puppy. ;-)

UPDATE:

Tested creating a new save on NTFS with Slacko 5.3.3, and as rcrsn51 suspected it had the same problems as I've seen with some but not all of this round of Slacko test builds. Wary 5.3.90 also had a seemingly faulty save in that it ran the initial setup dialogues again, but once it got to the desktop the icons and backdrop were intact.
Zhaan - AMD K6 2 500, 512MB RAM, ATI Rage 128 VR. Full install Wary 5.5 [url=http://tinyurl.com/dy66kh8]HardInfo Report[/url]
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