Which Puppy for an older computer?

Booting, installing, newbie
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circularL7
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Joined: Sat 02 Feb 2013, 07:26

Which Puppy for an older computer?

#1 Post by circularL7 »

I've searched, but I didn't find anything that helped me (in a way that I understood).

Computer info: late 90's HP Intel Celeron; 266Mhz; Win 98; 112MB RAM; maybe 5GB.

My goals: I want to completely remove Win from the machine and run Wary because I never liked Windows. I want the machine to boot into Wary just like it does Win. And I want the full version, not frugal.

What I've done: I burned Wary to a CD as an image. I did this according to the Win 7 help that directed me to use an older format. (I think that's the right description.) I placed the CD in the target computer's CD reader.

I restarted the computer and went into BIOS and changed the start-up order to begin at the CD reader. I restarted the computer, but it didn't start in Wary, so I went back to the screen on which the boot order is displayed and the screen also says: The system attempts to boot to the operating system from the first hard-drive in this list.

(I suspect that that means that it doesn't matter that I changed the order because it ignores the order until the OS on the hard-drive is found. But I don't know.)

Another detail that might be relevant is that when I click on the CD icon in the Computer folder, a box appears that says: M:\ is not accessible. The device is not ready.

Please help.

Dewbie

#2 Post by Dewbie »

First, check the CD.
You should see, among others, the following files:
initrd.gz
puppy_wary_(version).sfs
vmlinuz


Before full-installing, you will need to choose the puppy pfix=ram boot option.
Then go to Menu / System / GParted.
Format the Puppy partition with either ext2 or ext3 filesystem.
Then set up a 400MB Linux-swap partition.
(This is how you compensate for insufficient RAM; same idea as pagefile.sys with Windows.)
I want the machine to boot into Wary just like it does Win.
Then use this as your bootloader.
It's easier to work with than regular GRUB.

And for a machine of that vintage, I strongly suggest this instead of Wary.
Also, have a look at the manual.
Last edited by Dewbie on Sat 02 Feb 2013, 10:01, edited 1 time in total.

circularL7
Posts: 112
Joined: Sat 02 Feb 2013, 07:26

#3 Post by circularL7 »

Problem 1 found. I burned the shortcut, not the program.

I thought that Wary was the route to take because of its age. The other is better?

Dewbie

#4 Post by Dewbie »

If the CD-burning software isn't working properly, there's a suggestion in the manual.
(see link above)

2.14x should work better with your hardware, especially given the slower processor speed and limited RAM.
(Wary typically requires a bit more of both.)

However, 2.14x's built-in Firefox browser might be a bit heavy, so install and use this if needed.

circularL7
Posts: 112
Joined: Sat 02 Feb 2013, 07:26

#5 Post by circularL7 »

Sadly, it's the operator, not the burner.

So, I burned this: http://www.smokey01.com/ttuuxxx/2.14X/i ... top6.2.iso. I haven't partitioned the hard drive yet, but I wanted to update you because this seemed interesting. I burned it properly. The CD is in the reader. When I boot, the reader light illuminates before the screen shows anything, the reader opens (expelling the CD), and then the machine proceeds to boot Win.

I'll start working on the manual next, but I wanted to give an update if only for your entertainment.

Thank you for the help and recommendation.

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greengeek
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#6 Post by greengeek »

When you burn the CD double check that the type of burn is "burn image", not "burn file" or "burn data".

circularL7
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#7 Post by circularL7 »

I definitely burned it as an image, but I'm now trying to follow the directions presented in the manual.

Thus far, I have downloaded 2.14x to the target's hard drive. That is what the manual advises for Puppy; I hope that that is also right for 2.14x. I also downloaded md5sum.exe, which is the MS-DOS program that the manual advises me to download to the target.

However, the manual advises that I Start|Run and enter "cmd" in the input window. But when I enter it, a dialogue box appears, and it states: Cannot find the file 'cmd' (or one of its components). Make sure the path and filename are correct and that all required libraries are available.

Both of the downloaded programs are on my desktop. Should I have put them someplace else?

Edit/Update: I did a little research and tried "command" in the input window and my DOS-box appeared. Will update.

circularL7
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Joined: Sat 02 Feb 2013, 07:26

#8 Post by circularL7 »

Latest: My DOS-Box opens, and "C:\WINDOWS\Desktop>" appears. I assume that this is the directory, and I should be able to enter something referencing 2.14x. However, I've entered a dozen or more variations of it, from 214x with the x in upper and lower case to the entire file name, but the box responds with "bad command or file name" to every attempt.

Any suggestions?

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Colonel Panic
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#9 Post by Colonel Panic »

There are alternatives to 2.14X Classic if you can't get it working. Firstly there's Turbo Pup or Turbo Extreme;

http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=40477

There's also Teenpup as it used to be called (now Legacy Pup) which is specially designed for old machines and should run on yours, though I wouldn't promise anything;

http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewto ... 47&t=59463

Hope this helps,

CP .
Gigabyte M68MT-52P motherboard, AMD Athlon II X4 630, 5.8 GB of DDR3 RAM and a 250 GB Hitachi hard drive running Ubuntu 16.04.6, MX-19.2, Peppermint 10, PCLinuxOS 20.02, LXLE 18.04.3, Pardus 19.2, exGENT 200119, Bionic Pup 8.0 and Xenial CE 7.5 XL.

gcmartin

What is the PC that you are using to post from

#10 Post by gcmartin »

Hi @circularL7. Welcome to Puppyland.

This may seem off-topic to your request, but beer with me.

You are using a PC to post here. What is the make and the model of this PC you are using?

I've got an idea that may help you get the other very old (pre 1999) computer to run easily.

Here to help

circularL7
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Joined: Sat 02 Feb 2013, 07:26

#11 Post by circularL7 »

Hey, Colonel. Thanks for the response (and to everyone else too).

I'm thinking that I've tried three different Puppy versions, and I'm not knowledgeable enough to get any of them to work, so I'd like to stick with one, any one, while I learn something here. Once I get my mittens off and start typing like a big boy, I expect that I can switch relatively easily.

Which version intersects at easiest to get going and easiest to get information about? This PC has been sitting for years. I plug it in twice a year, punch some keys, and shut it off in disgust, so I don't mind putting some time in to learn new stuff; I've kept it this long for that very reason.

Hi, Martin. Thanks for the welcome.

I'm borrowing the use of this PC. The owner permits me to download and burn from it, but I don't want to impose by asking to use it for more than that.

I can and have connected the target to the internet; that's how I downloaded 2.14x and the other program. (The nice thing about doing that is that I have plenty of time to go shopping, and eat, and take naps, and. . . while it downloads.)

Dewbie

#12 Post by Dewbie »

circularL7 wrote:
I definitely burned it as an image
OK, before anything else, let's test it...
Are the initrd.gz, vmlinuz, etc. files shown on that disc?
If so, can you set (either) computer's BIOS to boot from CD first, insert the CD, and then see if it boots?
(Wish I had mentioned this before...:roll:)

Also, ttuuxxx usually numbers 2.14x sequentially, so the latest version is Top 10.
If 2.14x works for you, I would select that version instead, as Top 6.2 has keybinding problems.

circularL7
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#13 Post by circularL7 »

I erased that disk, Dewbie, but thank you. I figured that I'd try something else with more info that was more easily accessible. But what I had found during my fumbling around is that there were eight or so items when I checked the CD on this computer, but the target computer's CD reader is "not ready" when I try it in that one, and I did this with two different brands of CD readers, and I used one of those CD readers to reformat the drive today (I reloaded 95, then 98, and then Word 2000), so the reader works.

starhawk
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#14 Post by starhawk »

Frequently CDs will only work in older computers if burned at a slower speed. Burning at 4x is "compatibility mode" for your CD-R/RW media -- that's the lowest speed you can go and still have the drive read your stuff.

circularL7
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#15 Post by circularL7 »

I tried burning with Windows and Power2Go, but both only gave me the option of 10x. My CD-RW's are rated at 12x.

I also have a stray CD-RW that doesn't list its rating. I'll give that a shot, and maybe I'll have more options, but if you have any suggestions, I'm all eyes.

Edit/Update: Get this: I had swapped the OEM CD reader with a CD reader/writer, which I had picked up second hand for one dollar. When I had opened it, I discovered a CD marked "back up." That CD was my "stray," and when I erased it and rewrote it, the burner only gave me the option of 4x, and that CD is readable by the target.

It still doesn't boot into Puppy (tried 4.3.1 again), but it's progress.

infromthepound
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#16 Post by infromthepound »

If I have to burn a CD/DVD as an ISO with "Doze, I use Deep Burner (The free version). I find it very simple.
I think that daemon Tools Lite is highly regarded too (And it's free)
JB

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Fossil
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Location: Gloucestershire, UK.

#17 Post by Fossil »

One of the simplest programs to burn an ISO to a CD, via Windows, is BurnCDCC. It's free. Get it from here.
http://www.terabyteunlimited.com/downlo ... ftware.htm
Make sure that the host CD/RW is completely clean and reformatted - without traces of any previous programs - before burning a new ISO. Burn slowly. Lack of computer memory is going to be your major problem - you can't cram a quart into a pint pot! A smaller Puppy is the way to go. Perhaps try, Puppy-4.1.2-lite (71mb), from here: http://412collection.co.uk/b-bones.php#bb
A Linux swap-partition is also going to be a necessity. Please follow Dewbie's advice.

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Ray MK
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#18 Post by Ray MK »

Hi circularL7 and welcome to Puppyland (aka The Kennels).
Dewbie’s advice is very good and should get you going quickly.
BurnCDCC - extremely good, probably the best (with windows).
Hopefully - some of the following may also be of use.

leave w98 as is for the moment, but fully defrag your hdd before doing anything radical, if not already done.

Wary won’t run well on your machine, but other Puppy’s will.

Try Puppy 3.01, Puppy 2.14 and MeanPup 2.02
burn to a CD - boot and see which puppy runs best.
would start with Puppy 3.01 because it’s still very capable.

An afterthought - 2 more very usable puppy’s are Breeezy and Safepup.
And as suggested - a 412 puppy from the 412 collection would be another excellent choice - which reminds me - ChoicePup - well worth a look.

Once one puppy is booted and up and running - your machine can be properly prepared for the installations of many more.

Hope you have lots of fun with Puppy and that you find it as easy to use and as useful as I have. Very best regards - Ray
[b]Asus[/b] 701SD. 2gig ram. 8gb SSD. [b]IBM A21m[/b] laptop. 192mb ram. PIII Coppermine proc. [b]X60[/b] T2400 1.8Ghz proc. 2gig ram. 80gb hdd. [b]T41[/b] Pentium M 1400Mhz. 512mb ram.

jakfish
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#19 Post by jakfish »

4.31 is a good puppy for your specs. I use it on P1 133 computer with 114mb RAM. It runs better than its original OS (W2K).

Good luck w/ getting it up and running. Just think of all you're learning along the way :)

Jake

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greengeek
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#20 Post by greengeek »

CD and CDRW media contains information that specifies the burning speeds they can support. Some burning programs will only offer you the burning speeds that they think the particular CDRW wants to use. If I were you I would try to get hold of a CDR rather than a CDRW, and try to find a burning program that WILL let you select 4x as the burning speed. (of course it might be that your burner is only capable of 10x minimum but I suspect not)

I haven't had any success using CDRWs on my systems, but some other people use them successfully all the time. I think it may be more reliable to stick to CDRs to try and get past this problem.

EDIT: oops, I missed your comment about having found another disk that DOES write at 4x. I would still try to find a CDR though if poss...

EDIT: If it turns out not to be burn related it could be an issue with ram size, or that the PC doesn't handle CD booting the same way other machines do. Maybe have a look at this post/topic:
http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic. ... 0&start=24 Forum member eskimo (not the original poster for that thread..) added some questions about CD boot problems on his machine and there were a variety of replies from sfeeley, monsie, dewbie and tommy etc about how to use a floppy or a specially made CD to access the puppy files.

If your machine doesn't like booting Puppy from CD you may have to look at some of those alternatives.

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