apt-get working on Puppy 5 lupu pretty simple

Using applications, configuring, problems
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sickgut
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apt-get working on Puppy 5 lupu pretty simple

#1 Post by sickgut »

Hi,

On the official puppy linux irc channel you have probably heared me yammering on about how I would like to get apt-get to work with puppy.
So finally I got around to it and I have a solution available at my website:

http://www.thepussycatforest.info/apt-get

I havent learned how to make .pets and things yet, but this is pretty straight forward. Just download every file in the directory on that site. Simply click on the 4x .deb packages and move the status, sources.list and available files to their respective dirs on your puppy 5 lupu installation and you are ready to rock.

There is a README.txt file on my site explaining the ins and outs of to set it up and how it works on a puppy system.

Yes, it works on frugal systems aswell as full HDD installs.

It took me a while to setup the status file propperly it is more than 4000 lines of code and I typed it all by hand as I do not know of any automation processes. The status file contains all the packages that a standard puppy 5 lupu install contains but i have not listed the dependencies for all the standard packages, this means that apt-get removing packages that come standard with puppy will not work propperly. However, if you apt-get install something then apt-get remove it, the uninstallation of that program will work just fine.

The status and available files get populated properly by apt as you install and remove stuff.

Apart from not being useful for uninstalling default puppy apps from a clean install, the only other limitation with this is some spam when it actually installs a program. Its error spam due to an empty available file but this is not critical and even tho it complains everything still works fine.
Also please remember that if you have installed programs some way other than using apt, the status file will not know about these programs, so if you install firefox from a .pet you cant uninstall from apt.

I have tested this with a few small progs like nano and things and its awesome.

I think this will be useful for people (like me) who run a cli only server and would like to have a text based package manager. Also apt is very good at dealing with dependencies and may be less annoying than dealing with the ubuntu repos from the ppm.

Also I know the source.list file kinda sucks and is lame. At present I have only listed a few there more as a proof of concept than anything else,
If someone has a awesome pimped out source.list file they wouldnt mind sharing then ill include that file on my site instead of this lame one.

Have fun
Sickgut

cinclus_cinclus
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#2 Post by cinclus_cinclus »

I wonder if I could use the ubuntu-wine/ppa-repository with your apt/aptitude packages.

Wine's Ubuntu-packages are in a ppa-repository which would have an entry in Ubuntu's /etc/apt/sources.list:

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deb http://ppa.launchpad.net/ubuntu-wine/ppa/ubuntu lucid main
Before I have to know how to install your packages.

When opening

http://www.thepussycatforest.info/apt-get/README.txt

I get an

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403 - Forbidden
error message.

Did you make the file README.txt readable on your server?

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sorry, its fixed now

#3 Post by sickgut »

Hi cinclus_cinclus

Im sorry about that readme.txt not being accessable it must have been corrupted somehow. Ive posted a new file on that site " install.txt " and ive surfed over to it myself and im sure its working now.

In answer to your question about adding that repo, yes you can.
I think adding debian repos might work ok aswell.

incase there are more probs with the .txt file instructions then
to install all you have to do it download every file in that web directory
and click on the .deb files in turn. Then move or copy:

status file to: /var/lib/dpkg/
available file to: /var/lib/dpkg/
sources.list file to: /etc/apt/

remember to run apt-get update before you try getting anything.

let me know if you have any more probs or the .txt is in accessable or something. if there is any more probs ill simply make a .tar.gz file and post it here and list the instructions here. im only hosting from my site to save other people bandwidth etc.

Sickgut

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readme.txt changed

#4 Post by sickgut »

Hi as pointed out to me the README.txt file wasnt viewable by a browser, i have fixed the problem, the file is called install.txt and it works now. somehow the old file got corrupted or something i dunno.

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#5 Post by Lobster »

http://www.thepussycatforest.info/apt-get

What is the most complex program you have apt-gotted (if that is termed correctly)
into Lucid?
Can apt get also download dependencies?
Not used it much :oops:

Thanks for advice 8)
Puppy Raspup 8.2Final 8)
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you need devx installed

#6 Post by sickgut »

I have only just realised after setting up apt-get on a fresh lupu installation that you need devx installed. I may be able to get around this and just include a few files that apt-get needs from the devx to work.

devx is a large file and this just may put apt-get out of reach for ppl who want very minimal installs.

i have included the lupu_devx_500.sfs file on my site, i know its available everywhere else but if you are downloading the packages for apt-get and need the devx, its there in one easy place.

Also ill update my install.txt to include intructions for installing the devx.sfs file onto full hdd installs

sickgut

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#7 Post by sickgut »

Lobster wrote:http://www.thepussycatforest.info/apt-get

What is the most complex program you have apt-gotted (if that is termed correctly)
into Lucid?
Can apt get also download dependencies?
Not used it much :oops:

Thanks for advice 8)
Hi Lobster here is an example of apt-get dependencies handling:

# apt-get install xaos
Reading package lists... Done
Building dependency tree
Reading state information... Done
The following extra packages will be installed:
libaa1 libgpm2 libgsl0ldbl zlib1g
Suggested packages:
gpm gsl-ref-psdoc gsl-doc-pdf gsl-doc-info gsl-ref-html
The following NEW packages will be installed:
libaa1 libgpm2 libgsl0ldbl xaos
The following packages will be upgraded:
zlib1g
1 upgraded, 4 newly installed, 0 to remove and 703 not upgraded.
Need to get 1,577kB of archives.
After this operation, 5,292kB of additional disk space will be used.
Do you want to continue [Y/n]? y
WARNING: The following packages cannot be authenticated!
libgpm2 zlib1g libaa1 libgsl0ldbl xaos
Install these packages without verification [y/N]?

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I was using nano as an example because before i had a working status file it was wanting to download 84mb and almost the entire base system ti install nano, i knew the status file was working when after apt-get install nano was entered it was going to only fetch one file.

Also be aware that apt-get mostly likes to install the lastest version of stuff so sometimes it might seem its doubling up on stuff you already have but there is probably a 0.1 version number difference and will wanna install it.

My experience with puppy package manager is that it handles depencencied woefully, but the apt-get is damn near fool proof, it will err on the side of downloading stuff rather than not.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hope this helps
Sickgut

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#8 Post by cinclus_cinclus »

I have devx installed but have some problems.
If I

Code: Select all

apt-get update
I get several gpg-errors:

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W: GPG error: http://archive.canonical.com lucid Release: No keyring installed in /etc/apt/trusted.gpg.d/.
W: GPG error: http://security.ubuntu.com lucid-security Release: No keyring installed in /etc/apt/trusted.gpg.d/.
W: GPG error: http://gb.archive.ubuntu.com lucid Release: No keyring installed in /etc/apt/trusted.gpg.d/.
W: GPG error: http://gb.archive.ubuntu.com lucid-updates Release: No keyring installed in /etc/apt/trusted.gpg.d/.
W: GPG error: http://gb.archive.ubuntu.com lucid-backports Release: No keyring installed in /etc/apt/trusted.gpg.d/.
For aptitude there is a missing library:

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aptitude: error while loading shared libraries: libcwidget.so.3: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory

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#9 Post by Lobster »

many thanks for info 8)
apt-get on a fresh lupu installation that you need devx installed
Creates rather a lot of questions . . . :oops:

That means a complete usage would entail installing a rather large sfs
Are you aware of what is required from devx? Apt compiles programs if required
using c and c++ and the Linux core libraries. Is that right?
Does Lucid with the devx have the Linux core?

Is it possible to use an 'apt no compiling' option?
That might make it suitable for Lucid . . .

Am I right that with the right options you could use devx
and apt have the compiled dependencies and then provide a pet?

Sorry for all the questions :oops:
My policy is Quickpet (or Ubuntu software manager)
then synaptic and then (and only then) apt-get

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Dont worry about GPG

#10 Post by sickgut »

cinclus_cinclus wrote:I have devx installed but have some problems.
If I

Code: Select all

apt-get update
I get several gpg-errors:

Code: Select all

W: GPG error: http://archive.canonical.com lucid Release: No keyring installed in /etc/apt/trusted.gpg.d/.
W: GPG error: http://security.ubuntu.com lucid-security Release: No keyring installed in /etc/apt/trusted.gpg.d/.
W: GPG error: http://gb.archive.ubuntu.com lucid Release: No keyring installed in /etc/apt/trusted.gpg.d/.
W: GPG error: http://gb.archive.ubuntu.com lucid-updates Release: No keyring installed in /etc/apt/trusted.gpg.d/.
W: GPG error: http://gb.archive.ubuntu.com lucid-backports Release: No keyring installed in /etc/apt/trusted.gpg.d/.
For aptitude there is a missing library:

Code: Select all

aptitude: error while loading shared libraries: libcwidget.so.3: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory
Hi cinclus_cinclus

Dont worry about the GPG errors this is non critical error spam. apt-get works but it does complain sometimes. these repos its complaining about will still work.

Regarding your missing lib that apt depends on I have uploaded it to www.thepussycatforest.info/apt-get
you can download it from here and click on it and it should auto install.

I didnt get this problem you are having but I spose no two systems are alike if they have even slightly different software installed. Please let me know if you are missing any other libs and things ill upload those as well.

Hope this helps.
sickgut

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dunno

#11 Post by sickgut »

Lobster wrote:many thanks for info 8)
apt-get on a fresh lupu installation that you need devx installed
Creates rather a lot of questions . . . :oops:

That means a complete usage would entail installing a rather large sfs
Are you aware of what is required from devx? Apt compiles programs if required
using c and c++ and the Linux core libraries. Is that right?
Does Lucid with the devx have the Linux core?

Is it possible to use an 'apt no compiling' option?
That might make it suitable for Lucid . . .

Am I right that with the right options you could use devx
and apt have the compiled dependencies and then provide a pet?

Sorry for all the questions :oops:
My policy is Quickpet (or Ubuntu software manager)
then synaptic and then (and only then) apt-get

I am such a penguin quiche eater :shock:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Real_Men_D ... Eat_Quiche
Hi Lobster

I am sorry but I have basicly no answers for your questions.
Only that yes apt seems to need devx, and no I dont know what files from
devx it needs. I will try and find this out myself later as I am kinda burnt out at the moment, after i stop having nightmares about the status file and my fingertips grow back from typing it out ill spend some more time looking under the hood.

I am aware that devx is huge and it may put apt out of reach of alot of
users that dont have that extra 120 or so mb hdd space or ram or whatever. I was quite dissapointed when I noticed that apt-get didnt work without devx, but hey that the way it goes.

I am not knowledgeable about all the compiling stuff after apt-get downloads. I dont even know how to make a .pet let alone rig apt-get to spit one out. I have no idea about devx containing the linux core or even what that means in an accurate sense.

Sorry I cant help you much lol

Sickgut

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one other thing

#12 Post by sickgut »

There is also another issue i have failed to address about apt on this forum.

some of what apt seems to want to download may seem to be excessive in size. This is because unlike propper pets and things, the apt-get packages that it will try to install are not timmed down. The puppy package manager has the option to trim the fat, apt doesnt do this.

Iglueder who you all probably know from the irc chan or this forum has made a script that can create a new status file in a few seconds from a txt file that contains the list of packages. This is cool coz it means that when the next version of puppy is released all we have to do is grab hold of the package list, run the script, install the debs and boom, apt-get working on a new puppy release. Well i thought this was cool. Saves having to type the thing manually if you want apt-get on new puppy releases.

Sickgut

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#13 Post by big_bass »

Hey sickgut
I was quite dissapointed when I noticed that apt-get didnt work without devx, but hey that the way it goes.
I understand the work required to set up another package management system and do the coding on something that wasnt set up for it such as puppy
I got slackware package tools and slitaz package tools running on a puppy version both very small and fast I later decided to go with full package compatibility thats probably your next step using deb packages

and apt-get is much more complex because of the dependency resolving

it would be nice if you could diff out the original files to your modified files
since not many people will be able to jump in and figure out what changed and where its also good for yourself while its still fresh in your mind

the trouble you are having with devx isnt that complicated
after all the coding you had to do

it just requires you to check dependencies on the bin's that are used by
apt-get in other words what does apt-get itself depend on

making a cut down "devx" is no big deal I cut devx down to 40 mb and it still compiles nicely so you could cut it down a lot smaller and even upgrade the gcc easily

I am not a debian so called user debian does have a good system but official package management does interest me
and I wanted to wish you good luck and say thanks for posting your work

Joe

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Thanks and two questions for sickgut

#14 Post by stevesr0 »

Hi,

I want to use apt-get wiith lupu and saw this thread. Looks great. Thanks in advance.

I have two questions:

(1) I wanted to look at the status and available files out of curiosity and was surprised that it came up as a .BIN file not a .TXT.

I looked at these two files on another computer (running debian) and both are text files.

Are the files (status and available) actually text files?

(2) I am helping someone trying out Lupu, running a live-CD. Is there a reason apt-get can't be installed by your method?

Thanks again.

Steve

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#15 Post by paulhomebus »

Here is my method for apt-getting on Lupu...

1. Download sickgut's apt files & install them (by clicking on them.)
2. Download my apt-conf.tar.gz and untar to your /
http://www.4shared.com/file/CDVjEBtY/apt-conftar.html
3. Find these dependencies for Gnupg keyring from package.ubuntu.com
|-- gnupg-curl_1.4.10-2ubuntu1_i386.deb
|-- gnupg_1.4.10-2ubuntu1_i386.deb
|-- gpgv_1.4.10-2ubuntu1_i386.deb
|-- libbz2-1.0_1.0.5-4_i386.deb
|-- libcurl3-gnutls_7.19.7-1ubuntu1_i386.deb
|-- libldap-2.4-2_2.4.21-0ubuntu5.2_i386.deb
|-- libreadline6_6.1-1_i386.deb
`-- libusb-0.1-4_0.1.12-14_i386.deb
& install them by clicking on them.

The magic is done by a modified apt.conf file found under /etc/apt

(modify your sources.list file to use the US Ubuntu archives, my apt-conf.tar.gz includes the NZ archives, Opera's Beta PPA, wxwidgets PPA & Google Chrome's PPA) - Or you could just replace my sources.list with sickgut's.

4. run apt-get update to check if it all works.

Hope this helps...
BTW - if Iguleder will post his script for creating the status file, then I think we will be pretty close to having apt functional on Lupu.

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#16 Post by Iguleder »

Ummm ... I lost it :oops:

I remember I wrote it in about 10 minutes ... I'll write a new one and probably discuss this in IRC :)
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[url=https://github.com/dimkr]My GitHub profile[/url]

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Re: Thanks and two questions for sickgut

#17 Post by sickgut »

stevesr0 wrote:Hi,

I want to use apt-get wiith lupu and saw this thread. Looks great. Thanks in advance.

I have two questions:

(1) I wanted to look at the status and available files out of curiosity and was surprised that it came up as a .BIN file not a .TXT.

I looked at these two files on another computer (running debian) and both are text files.

Are the files (status and available) actually text files?

(2) I am helping someone trying out Lupu, running a live-CD. Is there a reason apt-get can't be installed by your method?

Thanks again.

Steve
_________________________________
Hi Steve

In answer to your first question, yes they are text files but do not have a .txt extention on the end of their filenames. If you open them up in a wordprocessor or something like gedit or leafpad or something you will be able to edit and read/ save to these files. The apt program doesnt recognise these files when they have the .txt extention on them. Most config files in linux are plain text but do not have .txt extentions, either no extention or a different extention, for example xorg.conf or menu.lst these are 2 common linux config files that are in text format but do not have the .txt extention on their filename. Most programs like browsers for example judge the type of file is by the extention (usually a period followed by three letters). I think its quite common for alot of programs to presume a file is a BIN file when there is no 3 letter file extention. Basicly your browser is just confused.

In answer to your seccond question, if you actually have a save file setup that the live cd finds so that you can save settings and programs etc in it then there is no reason apt wont work. But be warned, it isnt a fool proof system and apt will install stuff fresh off the ubuntu repos and ubuntu stuff isnt as fat free as Puppy Lupu, also apt may overwrite some existing puppy files with newer but more bloated ubuntu versions. this isnt as bad as is sounds but if there isnt a pet already available for the software you wanna retrieve from apt-get then you will end up with bloated versions anyway, so you may aswell apt-get it.

I have not tested apt with getting newer versions of critical puppy files and i have had one experience when i apt-got something and it overwrote my shutdown.rc script and made it revert to ubuntu commands to shutdown and the shutdown menu in puppy didnt work. I had to crash out to console and type shutdown now -h or something similar to poweroff the computer and then it wouldnt boot puppy propperly.

Having said the above paragraph that is full of fear, shock tactics and regret, although true is a worst case scenario. I was testing apt's limits and purposely upgraded some key component in puppy and was deliberatley trying to break my system just to see if it could be done.

My advice to people using apt-get (my standard version not paulhomebus's improved updates, i do not know yet about what has been fixed with it) is to apt-get programs that dont depend heavily on core stuff. A good example is Xaos, or nano, or maybe transmission and certainly some games, that will work fine. Dont apt-get anything to do with the kernel or drivers or xorg or even things like vlc or mplayer have alot of dependencies and can potentially overwite stuff you need, or install newer versions that do not follow the rules that puppy follows, install the dependency just fine but not with the propper script. Some programs have 40 or so dependencies and some dont. If you try to apt-get something with a large amount of dep's and there is files names with anything that looks important, please err on the side of caution and do not install it.

Also there are circular dependency issues with something called base-files. Some popular programs like vlc and mplayer depend on this being there and its meant to be already installed on an Ubuntu system. Its not supposed to be installed by apt, altho apt will try to.do it but will fail. Aparently this is a problem with ubuntu itself as other ubuntu mini distros cannot handle this either.

Peace out ..V,
sickgut

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#18 Post by Hesse James »

Good morning paulhomebus
I tried to download your modified apt.conf file but the download failed because of a missing page on that server. Could you please make it available elsewhere ? I would like to try your modifications whether they allow an installation or not (purely academic interest).
Recently I have put together an apt-get.sfs according to sickguts file recommendations adding a borrowed etc/apt directory content from Ubuntu. On Lupu5.1 this apt-get works ok for downloading, not for installation.
I used it successfully to download some other deb-libs including their dependencies for my QBasic64 for linux (Lupu). The Puppy installer failed resolving all the dependencies.
Have a nice day.

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#19 Post by sickgut »

hi hesse james

ill see if i can get the extra stuff from paulhomebus and upload it to my current apt-get download thing at http://www.thepussycatforest.info/linux/apt-get/
so that its all in the one place

_____________
Update:

The extra stuff paulhomebus put together for apt-get is now available at the same location as my apt-get solution.

http://www.thepussycatforest.info/linux/apt-get
______________
Last edited by sickgut on Mon 30 Aug 2010, 19:54, edited 1 time in total.

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#20 Post by Eyes-Only »

Hi Sickgut!

Just wanted to say that I've been using your apt-get/aptitude, and have combined it with Synaptic as well ( in my LucidPup-5.1 I should add here on a 65gig partition full install ) and, while as you say that it's not for the "beginner", I've been having fabulous success with all three with both installs and downloads, using the PPM to make up for any encountered "deficiencies" encountered.

I simply wanted to drop by and thank you from the bottom of my heart for all of the hard work which you've put into this project of yours - it really does show because of its quality! I've likewise brought your project to the attention of those working to officially attempt to port apt-get/Synaptic over for the next version of LucidPup ( or possibly the version thereafter ). Hopefully what with the fine work you've accomplished here that will place them all that much ahead in reaching that dream of achieving the "Ultimate Puppy": One binary-compatible with a LTS Ubuntu with complete access to their repos via apt-get/Synaptic!

Again Sickgut: Thank you for all your hard work in this project of yours. Please don't stop! People like you are very much needed around here, believe me! :D

Cheers/Amicalement!

Eyes-Only
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Proud user of LXpup and 3-Headed Dog. 8)
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