(old)Puppy Linux Discussion Forum

Hi everyone. I recently tried a Debian-based distro - Descent|OS 4.0.1 - and found it more flawed than I'd expect a release-standard distro to be (though not unusable), which is the main reason I haven't mentioned it in the "Other distros" thread here.

I shouldn't therefore have been as surprised as I was to find that the Descent|OS developer feels the same way; he calls Descent|OS 4 an "utter failure", and continues;

"I don’t like the Debian base, although it is better than the base I left. What that has left me with is a bunch of compatibility issues and upstream politics/decisions, something that has worn me out about any upstream base, not pointing any fingers."

http://www.descentos.org/blog/

(I think the previous base he's referring to is Ubuntu.)

I've also had problems trying to upgrade my installation of the Debian-based distro Saline 1.7, although as it's based on Debian Stable it doesn't really need upgrading too badly.

But all the same, if this is true it looks like a disaster in the making for the Linux community as (obviously) Debian is a very important distro in the Linux pantheon. I've even thought of using it as my main "installed" distro, though in the end I decided it was better to let others do the hard work of configuring it to make it easy to use than to spend probably hours of my own time trying to do the same thing (and probably not as well).

However, one by one the derivatives appear to be abandoning the Debian ship - future versions of Solus won't be based on Debian, for example, and I have to assume that Ikey knew what he was doing when he made that decision as he's a very experienced developer.

So, am I right in thinking there's a real problem with Debian right now? I'd be interested in hearing others' points of view about this.

Thanks in advance,

CP .

You are trying to compare debian with two of its' derivatives. with these knock-off distros you have no way of knowing what out-of-repo packages they have added or configs changed which mean that the normal debian upgrade mechanism won't properly work.

If you come and say that you installed debian using the debian installer and are then unable to successfully update it, then there is indeed a problem with debian. However, that is not very likely. Of course an upgrade without any 'hitches' is a difficult thing, but nobody does it better than debian.

From someone who is running Debian Stable,Testing and Unstable as well as several distros based on Debian (actually still have an install of oldstable Squeeze too) ..... I don't think there's any serious problems with the Debian mothership.

Problems could be appearing with some distros mixing repositories/packages..... I prefer to use Stable packages on Stable, Testing on Testing , etc., no mixing repos ....... haven't had any real problems.Some users/developers thing that Debian Stable is boring, newer is better, but there is a reason it's called "stable". Wonder if there's a reason Unstable is called "unstable"?

Saline is I believe based on Squeeze, I wouldn't try to upgrade it to Wheezy but just my personal opinion. Long drawn-out reply but maybe you'll get something out of it.

amigo wrote:You are trying to compare debian with two of its' derivatives. with these knock-off distros you have no way of knowing what out-of-repo packages they have added or configs changed which mean that the normal debian upgrade mechanism won't properly work.

If you come and say that you installed debian using the debian installer and are then unable to successfully update it, then there is indeed a problem with debian. However, that is not very likely. Of course an upgrade without any 'hitches' is a difficult thing, but nobody does it better than debian.

All of this could well be true, but the inevitable conclusion then is that the devs of "knock off" distros which have experienced problems they've been unable to surmount (like Descent|OS) don't really know what they're doing, a conclusion I'd be reluctant to draw myself (or to put it another way, you can tell 'em that yourself if you want ).

James C wrote:From someone who is running Debian Stable,Testing and Unstable as well as several distros based on Debian (actually still have an install of oldstable Squeeze too) ..... I don't think there's any serious problems with the Debian mothership.

Problems could be appearing with some distros mixing repositories/packages..... I prefer to use Stable packages on Stable, Testing on Testing , etc., no mixing repos ....... haven't had any real problems.Some users/developers thing that Debian Stable is boring, newer is better, but there is a reason it's called "stable". Wonder if there's a reason Unstable is called "unstable"?

Saline is I believe based on Squeeze, I wouldn't try to upgrade it to Wheezy but just my personal opinion. Long drawn-out reply but maybe you'll get something out of it.

Thanks for replying James (and amigo too). Having spent most of my nine years using Linux being involved with Slackware-based distros, I have to admit I never really understood repos (and Debian's in particular). Maybe it's time I learnt how to use them.