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 Forum index » Taking the Puppy out for a walk » Misc
Android-x86 developments and issues
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nubc


Joined: 23 Jan 2007
Posts: 1833
Location: USA

PostPosted: Thu 07 Jul 2016, 13:18    Post subject:  

I had no luck booting marshmallow 6.0-rc1 on a uniprocessor system, I made it to Desktop on a more recent Core2 system, but this was accomplished by skipping every step of setup in order to get there. The mouse kept freezing when I tried to sign in to my Google account. When I got to Desktop I opened the native Browser and logged on to Puppy Discussion Forum, but before I could type the first word, Android said the Browser has stopped, and then the whole Desktop became grayed out and inoperable. I haven't gotten that far again, probably because Google is keeping track of the progress of registering this device (a Dell Precision desktop) and, upon next attempt, wants to advance to the point where things froze and failed. I did find that ethernet was automatically set up, and the connection speed was fast. This is a little unfortunate because I don't own a recent computer that will run the Linux kernel of this version, and I can't imagine a recent desktop really needing ethernet. The Android-x86 teams needs to backport ethernet support to older x86 versions such as that based on KitKat, which is probably unlikely to happen. Noticed: running the liveCD set my system clock ahead by 2 hours. Grrr
Last edited by nubc on Fri 08 Jul 2016, 07:14; edited 4 times in total
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gcmartin

Joined: 14 Oct 2005
Posts: 6730
Location: Earth

PostPosted: Thu 07 Jul 2016, 15:30    Post subject:  

Hello @Nubc. As you are aware, I follow this thread.

I became aware at a seminar last month of the movement in the OSes to include Android apps. Its happening in Microsoft and Apple, although not announced. Many are already aware of the ChromeOS tests that are already occurring where Android apps can run as apps on current specific targeted devices until full roll-out. We've already seen others such as Remix, etc that have provided Android solutions to the public. I happen to have a Remix.

I would like to take a moment to encourage anyone who ventures into Android land, whether as a standalone distro on a PC or via one of the above OSes that intend to support Android to NOT OVERLOOK the need for a touch system. Those apps, all Android apps are inherently designed for touch screen devices. MS's Surface and Apple's devices are built with what is needed as well as smartTablets and smartPhones; namely "touch" ability, as such there are no issues. But moving into the future, should one consider serious use, you may want to take note. This includes devices like Chromebox/Chromebook/Chromebase and any other Chrome devices should be looking at them for their inexpensive costs.

Its not an absolute requirement, but, a little understanding might be helpful should you want the best experience the apps are designed for. They are designed around developers expected user experience of touch/gesture/voice.

Just a note, FYI

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Pete


Joined: 02 Mar 2014
Posts: 675

PostPosted: Thu 07 Jul 2016, 18:31    Post subject:  

Perhaps I'm missing something, but why would anyone want to run an OS that is far inferior to Linux on a PC?

There are some very clever people working on this and dedicating loads of time, but why would anyone want to run an Android app on a PC when 99.999% of the time there is a better equivalent readily available especially for a PC?

It's bad enough being stuck with Android on a mobile device, why bring it to the desktop as well?

Is all this just for the technical challenge or are there advantages to being able to run Android on a PC?
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bark_bark_bark

Joined: 05 Jun 2012
Posts: 1931
Location: Wisconsin USA

PostPosted: Fri 08 Jul 2016, 07:58    Post subject:  

Pete wrote:
Perhaps I'm missing something, but why would anyone want to run an OS that is far inferior to Linux on a PC?

There are some very clever people working on this and dedicating loads of time, but why would anyone want to run an Android app on a PC when 99.999% of the time there is a better equivalent readily available especially for a PC?

It's bad enough being stuck with Android on a mobile device, why bring it to the desktop as well?

Is all this just for the technical challenge or are there advantages to being able to run Android on a PC?


The industry doesn't want you to ask questions, they just want you to obey and buy their new products.

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learnhow2code

Joined: 12 Jun 2016
Posts: 1015

PostPosted: Fri 08 Jul 2016, 08:26    Post subject:  

Pete wrote:
Perhaps I'm missing something, but why would anyone want to run an OS that is far inferior to Linux on a PC?


*shrug* some people like to be tied up and spanked. takes all sorts-- and this is kind of like doing that to your pc.
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Pete


Joined: 02 Mar 2014
Posts: 675

PostPosted: Fri 08 Jul 2016, 09:14    Post subject:  

bark_bark_bark wrote:

....
The industry doesn't want you to ask questions, they just want you to obey and buy their new products.


Pretty much.
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Pete


Joined: 02 Mar 2014
Posts: 675

PostPosted: Fri 08 Jul 2016, 09:15    Post subject:  

learnhow2code wrote:


*shrug* some people like to be tied up and spanked....


I'm sure there is an app for that. Laughing
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nubc


Joined: 23 Jan 2007
Posts: 1833
Location: USA

PostPosted: Fri 08 Jul 2016, 18:21    Post subject:  

Usage share of operating systems
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Usage_share_of_operating_systems

It's always been a hope that something will replace MS Windows, which became a fait accompli by default when Ballmer failed to recognize the mobile challenge to Microsoft's domination of the OS market, for which failure Ballmer was summarily fired. Changing masters from Microsoft to Google hasn't been the happiest outcome of Android's domination of the OS market, but it is an improvement, at least, in proprietary transparency. Meanwhile, Linux has never been anything more than a small blip on the OS graph. In addition to the novelty and excitement of fresh innovation, it's only natural that an interest in a new emerging OS has to do with monetary opportunity.

Last edited by nubc on Fri 08 Jul 2016, 18:48; edited 1 time in total
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Pete


Joined: 02 Mar 2014
Posts: 675

PostPosted: Fri 08 Jul 2016, 18:44    Post subject:  

No doubt Android is number 1 in mobile devices, but that does not make it great.
Look at Windows market share on PC's.

BTW, the figures in your link above are a tad misleading.
For example under Worldwide device shipments, all devices are together instead of mobile, desktop, servers etc.

Quote:

According to Gartner, the following is the worldwide device shipments (referring to full retail plus shipping) by operating system, which includes smartphones, tablets, laptops and PCs together.


That skews the totals as it stands to reason that in almost all countries, phone sales are going to be higher than PC sales.
Even if sales of mobile devices were equal to traditional computers, I still see no advantage/s of using Android on a PC.
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Pete


Joined: 02 Mar 2014
Posts: 675

PostPosted: Fri 08 Jul 2016, 18:53    Post subject:  

nubc wrote:
....
It's always been a hope that something will replace MS Windows....


I would argue that the demise of Microsoft will impact greatly even on us Linux users.
Don't get me wrong, I detest Windows but like it or not, they are the ones that drive forward innovations in hardware.
The sheer market share creates a need for more and more powerful (and faster) cpus, ram, buses at low cost.
We as Linux users directly benefit from this.

Quote:

Changing masters from Microsoft to Google hasn't been the happiest outcome of Android's domination of the OS market, but it is an improvement, at least, in proprietary transparency.


I wouldn't be so sure about that.
IMHO, Google is many times more a slippery customer than Microsoft will ever be.
Plus, Google is no better than Microsoft when it comes to security.
Co-incidentally in the news today:
http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-36744925
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Atle

Joined: 19 Nov 2008
Posts: 598
Location: Oslo, Norway

PostPosted: Fri 08 Jul 2016, 19:13    Post subject:  

I have nothing to contribute with apart from wishing I could run Android in order to use some apps every now and then, from within Puppy by using a technique as described for running Kali Linux inside your browser using docker

There are plenty of Android apps i find very useful that has no equivalent elsewhere...


atle
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Pete


Joined: 02 Mar 2014
Posts: 675

PostPosted: Fri 08 Jul 2016, 19:20    Post subject:  

Atle wrote:
I have nothing to contribute with apart from wishing I could run Android in order to use some apps every now and then, from within Puppy by using a technique as described for running Kali Linux inside your browser using docker

There are plenty of Android apps i find very useful that has no equivalent elsewhere...


atle


Hi Atle

Fair point, there may be a few apps that have no equivalent, but would you run the whole of Android just for the few apps or would you prefer to use a wine-type setup or some kind of emulator just for those apps?
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Atle

Joined: 19 Nov 2008
Posts: 598
Location: Oslo, Norway

PostPosted: Fri 08 Jul 2016, 19:24    Post subject:  

if that is simple and possible, then how no one did a "Android App Puppy"?

My guess is that is due to that not being a walk in the park...
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Pete


Joined: 02 Mar 2014
Posts: 675

PostPosted: Fri 08 Jul 2016, 19:27    Post subject:  

Atle wrote:
if that is simple and possible, then how no one did a "Android App Puppy"?

My guess is that is due to that not being a walk in the park...


I agree with you, it's not simple and I'm not even sure that it's currently possible.
I only asked you the question to gauge if an emulator would be something that you may be interested in.
I know i would be interested in being able to run the occasional app without having to run Android, much like I use Wine to run a few Windows pgms that have no Linux equivalents, but no ways would I load Windows on my machines, even if Windows was free.

So since the options at the moment seem to be, run full Android if you want some apps or nothing at all, I choose nothing at all as Android is just too limited, in-secure and generally lacking to make it worth while.

Last edited by Pete on Fri 08 Jul 2016, 19:33; edited 1 time in total
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Atle

Joined: 19 Nov 2008
Posts: 598
Location: Oslo, Norway

PostPosted: Fri 08 Jul 2016, 19:33    Post subject:  

If this docker thing works with Kali, I guess it would work with Android x86 as well if they did the same as Kali have done.

And then as I see it, Android x86 might become a SFS?

Anyone out there that is competent to look at how Kali did their docker and webbrowser thingy?

I am still at the "trying to get yourporn to work" level Wink
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