A simple question about Puppy's future
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koulaxizis
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Look, i use a desktop computer at my work and a netbook for personal use. I don't really like mobile devices, i don't like tablets, i don't like ubuntu. All i want is an up-to-date Puppy, i'm used to it, i'm emotionally attached to it and i love working with it every day. It's that simple...
[b]Christos Koulaxizis[/b]
[i]Woof woof from Greece![/i]
[color=darkred][url=https://sourceforge.net/projects/puppystuff/][ Puppy Stuff Repository ][/url][/color]
[i]Woof woof from Greece![/i]
[color=darkred][url=https://sourceforge.net/projects/puppystuff/][ Puppy Stuff Repository ][/url][/color]
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koulaxizis
- Posts: 452
- Joined: Sun 17 Jul 2011, 18:43
- Location: Greece
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Up-to-date only to support all software packages...jpeps wrote:What doesn't your computer do now, that needs to be brought "up to date"? It's a bit strange..Puppy is perfect for older computers.koulaxizis wrote:. All i want is an up-to-date Puppy:
[b]Christos Koulaxizis[/b]
[i]Woof woof from Greece![/i]
[color=darkred][url=https://sourceforge.net/projects/puppystuff/][ Puppy Stuff Repository ][/url][/color]
[i]Woof woof from Greece![/i]
[color=darkred][url=https://sourceforge.net/projects/puppystuff/][ Puppy Stuff Repository ][/url][/color]
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koulaxizis
- Posts: 452
- Joined: Sun 17 Jul 2011, 18:43
- Location: Greece
- Contact:
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koulaxizis
- Posts: 452
- Joined: Sun 17 Jul 2011, 18:43
- Location: Greece
- Contact:
x86 is certainly not gone, however ARM may soon run servers (mostly because of energy efficiency).James C wrote: Merely one link refuting the opinion that the desktop is dead while underpowered tablets and phones are the future of the computing world.
Regarding the "computing word" I have no idea but most computer users today use PCs for media consumption and communications. Tablets/phone can do it very well today and even better tomorrow, and if MS provides a tablet version of office in 2014 (as rumors have it) will be very little left to PC other than major production work.
== [url=http://www.catb.org/esr/faqs/smart-questions.html]Here is how to solve your[/url] [url=https://www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/~sgtatham/bugs.html]Linux problems fast[/url] ==
Back to topic.
).
In the other threads similar to this Nathan F (the original builder of Grafpup) has expressed interest in at least doing some of the partial work.
The fact that Iguleder and Elroy is expressing their concern can also be taken as they care and they would be willing to spend the effort to continue Puppy.
But that's not like the situation is new, we have puplets which are all different even today
Enough talking, let's get the ball rolling.
How to ensure Puppy's continuity in five (5) easy steps.
1) Clone Woof repository
2) Upload to a public hosting place (chiselapp.com if you still want to use fossil, or convert the repo to git and use github or repo.cz or whatever).
3) Make it public so others can make puppies from your Woof copy too.
4) Continue puppy building, making releases, etc - business as usual - plus making changes to your own Woof copy, as needed.
5) When Barry has finally appointed the official successor, merge the changes back to the official Woof line.
Notes:
a) As Mavrothal said elsewhere, chances are, whoever has shown the initiative to maintain (his/her own copy of) Woof (*and* if Barry likes the change), could be the one appointed as the official successor.
b) Even if you are *not* appointed, you'll get the warm feeling knowing that you've done the right thing; and by that time you have the choice of continuing your own work, or slowly adapt it to the official Woof line.
c) How you run the your project is up to you - you want to be another dictator? Go ahead. You want to form and listen to focus groups in this forum? Go ahead. Committee model suits you better? Go ahead. A full democracy - you listen and try to accomodate to anything that people in this forum has to say? Go ahead. Anything you like, nobody's stopping you, and if they do, you don't have to listen to them - it's *your* project. Anybody who doesn't like you, your project, your vision or the way you run things, is free to start their own.
Any takers?
EDIT: more notes:
d) You can do 1) & 2) because Puppy is GPL - thanks Barry!
e) You can do 4) as long as the name is not Puppy or something similar enough that can be confused with Puppy Linux; Puppy Linux is Barry's trademark and he has reserved its use for something that he approves. But you can call yours as something-pup name (or pup-something), I think I read somewhere that Barry has explicitly said that calling something-pup is okay
f) How is this different from building a variant puppy in existence? None at all, except that now you're taking charge of *everything* including the code in Woof (=read: can modify everything that you wish, including the base stuff).
Any takers?
Identify the person/team/group who will continue the Puppy development and then you can get the answer for this by asking that person/team/group. Asking this before we identify who "will do it" is putting the cart before the horse. Right now every good suggestion and feedback is going down the sinkhole because *nobody is listening*.koulaxizis wrote:Have we come up with a decision on which will be the next Puppy main stream and what binaries will be used?
darry1966 wrote:One needs to ask questions to get answers. So to answer your question how many people do you think are actively involved in Puppy to be part of a team well one only knows the answer to that by asking how many.
Yes, I can confirm at least one --> 01micko (that's why he said "don't panic"sunburnt wrote:### Are there any current Puppy variant devs. who intend to continue? .
).In the other threads similar to this Nathan F (the original builder of Grafpup) has expressed interest in at least doing some of the partial work.
The fact that Iguleder and Elroy is expressing their concern can also be taken as they care and they would be willing to spend the effort to continue Puppy.
It will continue. But it may not look like the Puppy you know. Each and everyone I said above has his own (and rather conflicting) views of how the new Puppy should look like. If jpeps has his way we'll probably have a "puppified Android"Like I said users have the right to know whether Puppy continues or will it just be like a Greatest Hits Rock'N"Roll Band having previously produced original material.
But that's not like the situation is new, we have puplets which are all different even today Enough talking, let's get the ball rolling.
How to ensure Puppy's continuity in five (5) easy steps.
1) Clone Woof repository
2) Upload to a public hosting place (chiselapp.com if you still want to use fossil, or convert the repo to git and use github or repo.cz or whatever).
3) Make it public so others can make puppies from your Woof copy too.
4) Continue puppy building, making releases, etc - business as usual - plus making changes to your own Woof copy, as needed.
5) When Barry has finally appointed the official successor, merge the changes back to the official Woof line.
Notes:
a) As Mavrothal said elsewhere, chances are, whoever has shown the initiative to maintain (his/her own copy of) Woof (*and* if Barry likes the change), could be the one appointed as the official successor.
b) Even if you are *not* appointed, you'll get the warm feeling knowing that you've done the right thing; and by that time you have the choice of continuing your own work, or slowly adapt it to the official Woof line.
c) How you run the your project is up to you - you want to be another dictator? Go ahead. You want to form and listen to focus groups in this forum? Go ahead. Committee model suits you better? Go ahead. A full democracy - you listen and try to accomodate to anything that people in this forum has to say? Go ahead. Anything you like, nobody's stopping you, and if they do, you don't have to listen to them - it's *your* project. Anybody who doesn't like you, your project, your vision or the way you run things, is free to start their own
.Any takers?
EDIT: more notes:
d) You can do 1) & 2) because Puppy is GPL - thanks Barry!
e) You can do 4) as long as the name is not Puppy or something similar enough that can be confused with Puppy Linux; Puppy Linux is Barry's trademark and he has reserved its use for something that he approves. But you can call yours as something-pup name (or pup-something), I think I read somewhere that Barry has explicitly said that calling something-pup is okay
f) How is this different from building a variant puppy in existence? None at all, except that now you're taking charge of *everything* including the code in Woof (=read: can modify everything that you wish, including the base stuff).
Any takers?
Fatdog64 forum links: [url=http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=117546]Latest version[/url] | [url=https://cutt.ly/ke8sn5H]Contributed packages[/url] | [url=https://cutt.ly/se8scrb]ISO builder[/url]
Another approach would be simply to let Puppy continue to fill the nitch for a minimized distro for PC's with older hardware (which is likely to still be around for years to come). Meanwhile, linux support for modern hardware likely will become available (Ubuntu?) and can be integrated if interest exists. Support for features like cloud printing can be added the same way dropbox and skype were, by professional developers that added linux support.jamesbond wrote:
Any takers?
BTW/ I think we went through this whole process several years ago, where tux put in his bid to take over from Barry. As you can see, nothing at all came of it and here we are.
not even closejamesbond wrote: If jpeps has his way we'll probably have a "puppified Android"
Glad to hear that 01micko and Nathan F are in the mix. Both are highly regarded.
As I say, the base Puppy should remain as-is. So there`s no conflicts here.
As JB said, variants do whatever they want, and are for the purpose of "variation".
If the few O.S. devs. can concentrate on their craft, Puppy will be better off for sure.
Apps. are a sore spot, if a group of app. builders forms, then this will improve also.
A Puppy-Android variant, or a Puppified Android, sure... Why not.? ( Apples & Oranges )
.
As I say, the base Puppy should remain as-is. So there`s no conflicts here.
As JB said, variants do whatever they want, and are for the purpose of "variation".
If the few O.S. devs. can concentrate on their craft, Puppy will be better off for sure.
Apps. are a sore spot, if a group of app. builders forms, then this will improve also.
A Puppy-Android variant, or a Puppified Android, sure... Why not.? ( Apples & Oranges )
.
Money generally works. In fact, I'd argue that you could easily get Barry out of retirement with viable incentives. Other than that, you'll just have to wait for a bright individual with an addiction issue.anikin wrote:We better start swearing allegiance to Micko ... and abjure our earlier commitments.
.
Indeed!jpeps wrote:Money generally works. In fact, I'd argue that you could easily get Barry out of retirement with viable incentives. Other than that, you'll just have to wait for a bright individual with an addiction issue.anikin wrote:We better start swearing allegiance to Micko ... and abjure our earlier commitments.
.
I can't complain though. While I do have 'donate' buttons on my sites I don't push for it and I do appreciate all the generous folks out there that have donated. Thanks.
Puppy Linux Blog - contact me for access
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gcmartin
This thread is a good one as it, when one steps backs and look at it, is a form of collaboration in how the discussion centers. The ideas shared here are useful where it allows each of us to "think" as we read what others share.
The ideas, thought as conflicted, are really not. They come together such that we can see the issues at hand and become more keenly sensed when we can join and work together for common goal(s).
A collaboration is a do-ocracy which often has differing skills contributing.
So here is yet another question for us:
Along the way, distro presentations has been marred by discussion of lean vs complete with little understanding of distro size vs distro ability to operate in RAM for user benefit. And, as members have already acknowledge, most of this community are using PCs which are less than 10 years old. And in the near future most of even those machines can/will disappear based upon technologies like Virtual Host and Terminal Server should they become accepted in PUP distros.
JPeps shares that the devices that are becoming common-place are, in fact, devices which could be embraced as we look to Puppy's future. This would be a similar view that Canonical was aiming at when they crowd-sourced.
TaZoC was the VERY FIRST PUPPY in LightHouse64 where it runs on a Touch device and one can use fingers to do what a mouse has done traditionally. He did this with one simple change that he recognized as significant in its use. Touch is here....if developer want, in a PUP desktop. With his, and with a Touch PC/Laptop, you can initiate and make use of the screen in a new and different way than we have in the past. This is in no way complete, but its an acknowledgement that some things can be addressed as technology presents for our use.
Puppy can continue, but, to do so, its members will come up with ways for collaboration to continue the trek and the success that has been achieved, to date. At least, one can be hopeful.
"Its not difficult" (as a TV commercial of a grown-up sitting a table of kids, purports)
The ideas, thought as conflicted, are really not. They come together such that we can see the issues at hand and become more keenly sensed when we can join and work together for common goal(s).
A collaboration is a do-ocracy which often has differing skills contributing.
So here is yet another question for us:
- What would be a idea for a formula that would make missions in Puppy, not just survive, but to also GROW in Puppy membership?
- And, along those lines what incentive (or approach) could be presented to make it attractive for participation?
Along the way, distro presentations has been marred by discussion of lean vs complete with little understanding of distro size vs distro ability to operate in RAM for user benefit. And, as members have already acknowledge, most of this community are using PCs which are less than 10 years old. And in the near future most of even those machines can/will disappear based upon technologies like Virtual Host and Terminal Server should they become accepted in PUP distros.
JPeps shares that the devices that are becoming common-place are, in fact, devices which could be embraced as we look to Puppy's future. This would be a similar view that Canonical was aiming at when they crowd-sourced.
TaZoC was the VERY FIRST PUPPY in LightHouse64 where it runs on a Touch device and one can use fingers to do what a mouse has done traditionally. He did this with one simple change that he recognized as significant in its use. Touch is here....if developer want, in a PUP desktop. With his, and with a Touch PC/Laptop, you can initiate and make use of the screen in a new and different way than we have in the past. This is in no way complete, but its an acknowledgement that some things can be addressed as technology presents for our use.
Puppy can continue, but, to do so, its members will come up with ways for collaboration to continue the trek and the success that has been achieved, to date. At least, one can be hopeful.
"Its not difficult" (as a TV commercial of a grown-up sitting a table of kids, purports)
A bit OT, but demonstrates the use of a Nexus 7 for taking notes at a Stem Cell Conference I just got back from at UC Berkeley. I used a mindmap app and a camera.gcmartin wrote:
JPeps shares that the devices that are becoming common-place are, in fact, devices which could be embraced as we look to Puppy's future. This would be a similar view that Canonical was aiming at when they crowd-sourced.
BTW/ If you want to regenerate neurons in the brain, it all happens through the hippocampus. What that requires is active learning, good sleep cycles, exercise, and lack of stress. Interesting that these are are same factors that prevent dementia.
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gcmartin
Ubuntu on a touch device
Although, this is NOT TaZoC's desktop, some of what you see here, in this video, I do with LightHouse64's desktop. The video shows a Ubuntu on a Nexus versus a PC, but the look and feel is the same on a Touch Screen capable PC. Viewing this demonstrates that Linux is making its way into new devices, while NOT abandoning the old PCs..
As Puppy distros evolve, we should expect to see similar ability across the PUP distro spectra, OOTB.
We could adjust some focus on a base-level of educationals/tutorials which would assist newbies to get up to speed, so to speak, to become assistants and contributors on the forum.
We just have to find ways to motivate and the means or ideas to attract. Again, I have found that the fraternal instincts that we humans possess, is a driver for collective cooperation.
FYI
As Puppy distros evolve, we should expect to see similar ability across the PUP distro spectra, OOTB.
We could adjust some focus on a base-level of educationals/tutorials which would assist newbies to get up to speed, so to speak, to become assistants and contributors on the forum.
We just have to find ways to motivate and the means or ideas to attract. Again, I have found that the fraternal instincts that we humans possess, is a driver for collective cooperation.
FYI
Re: Ubuntu on a touch device
Similar as in major effort by a dedicated team of developers still in it's early stages. I don't think Puppy needs to get involved ( i.e, has the resources) in laying the groundwork. sudo apt-get install?gcmartin wrote:
As Puppy distros evolve, we should expect to see similar ability across the PUP distro spectra, OOTB.
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/X/Blueprints/Touchscreen