Lucid Puppy Revitalized as 5.2.8.7 - Nov., 2017 - Final

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greengeek
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Re: Strange network connection issue.

#496 Post by greengeek »

Snail wrote:I have been running an early version of Sulu2 on my old HP desktop. Until a few days ago, I was connected to my gigabit-ethernet-capable router by a long patch cable.
Just to double check terminology - I thought "patch cable" referred to the short cables used in a network room to interconnect switches with patch panels. I thought they were wired differently to the standard network cables that connect your PC to the RJ45 wall socket (or at least they can be depending on which "standard" of wiring is chosen (eg T568A or T568B). (see here). Now that the cabling path has been changed it is possible that there may have been an inadvertent swap of transmit and receive pairs.

Most modern devices have the ability to autoswap their Tx and Rx pairs "on-the-fly" so maybe the router is now having to do that for your PC where it did not have to do it before. Maybe this could introduce timing alterations that are affecting the connection process.

It might be worth using a multimeter to verify that the end-to-end wiring using the new method is exactly identical to what it was before. If it is pin-to-pin identical then the issue must be due to cable length or resistance.

Unless of course the change has introduced different electronic hardware - are you still connecting to the same router or has that hardware been swapped as part of your ISP deal?

- and is there now a hub or switch that was not previously in the data path to the PC?

- how is the house wiring distributed? Is there a single cable from the router feeding a central electronic hub/switch that splits off to individual room wiring, or do you have a "house-wiring breakout panel" next to the router with individual wires from each patch connector to each port on the router?
.

Snail
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Joined: Sun 18 Oct 2009, 07:32

Re: Strange network connection issue

#497 Post by Snail »

Hi Rewin and Greengeek,

Thank you for your replies.

I have downloaded the latest Super4 and will try that. I'll also take a look at Frisbee. It may be a few days before I can get to the desktop machine location however.

The phone line crosstalk isn't the problem, I've disconnected that cable from the phone system to be sure.

The router and everything upstream of it is unchanged.

As far as I am aware, all modern ready-made ethernet cabling you can normally buy is wired straight through. The "cable-modem" crossover cables are very old technology. I could well be wrong here. However, in any case, I initially used the same very long cable I had been using before at the new computer location and that is when I discovered the problem.

I am using a 24-port patch panel in the cupboard. Each 8p8c jack in the house is wired to one of these ports and the port is then connected to the router by a patch cable to one of the router ports.

I obviously must have a slightly less than perfect hardware setup. I suspect it's my crappy punchdown tool and my DIY technique. However, once I do get connected, the speed is adequate for my needs and I don't get dropouts. My main point in raising the question here is the weirdness of the symptoms. Why does XP work perfectly when Puppy doesn't? And how on earth can AutoDHCP work when TEST claims that there is no connection? It appears to my uneducated eye that TEST and AutoDHCP are using different methods of looking for a signal?

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greengeek
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Re: Strange network connection issue

#498 Post by greengeek »

Snail wrote: However, in any case, I initially used the same very long cable I had been using before at the new computer location and that is when I discovered the problem.
True - but you now also have the cabling through the walls too - and that cabling can be introducing an Rx/Tx crossover depending on whether the connectors are colour marked for T568A or T568B. The only way to check this is with a multimeter measuring pin to pin from the connector now plugged into your network card on the PC, through to the end that plugs into your router. I used to have to do this sort of measuring when I was troubleshooting network connections to printers. Some printers had auto-sensing of rx/tx pairs and some didn't. You had to match the cable to the printer to get the pairs to match up.

Obviously in your setup the pairs must match eventually, or else you would never get a connection - but it's possible that the matching is now having to be done by the auto-sensing circuit in the router. That might upset the timing of the puppy network setup routine.
Why does XP work perfectly when Puppy doesn't?
I have had similar issues with different routers - some of them performed the connection/DHCP routine much better with XP than puppy, and some handled both ok. I used to have the situation where Barrys SNS setup would never run and only Dougals would work. After a router change it switched around and now SNS is more reliable. There must be some difference in how the dhcpcd routine works in puppy versus how XP does it.
And how on earth can AutoDHCP work when TEST claims that there is no connection?
That definitely leads me to suspect crossed rx/tx pairs forcing auto-sensing circuitry activation.
It appears to my uneducated eye that TEST and AutoDHCP are using different methods of looking for a signal?
Probably true.

Snail
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Re: Strange network connection issue

#499 Post by Snail »

Well I certainly thought I'd wired everything up to T568A. Can't check right now but I'll probably open things up and try to improve the punching at some point. I'll try the newer Sulu and Frisbee first though.

Even if auto-sensing has become involved, surely TEST has no way of knowing that?

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greengeek
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Re: Strange network connection issue

#500 Post by greengeek »

Snail wrote:Even if auto-sensing has become involved, surely TEST has no way of knowing that?
No, TEST won't have any idea about the electronics of the physical connection - it probably just sends some low level data request that gets a single response from any device on the network. As opposed to dhcpcd which is expecting a full DHCP protocol.

The fact that the DHCP connection no longer runs automatically suggests to me that the network simply does not have a ready connection at the critical time in puppy's boot process. It might just be a matter of a few milliseconds delay in getting an appropriate DHCP response.

Snail
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Re: Strange network connection issue

#501 Post by Snail »

I tried Super 4 and it booted to a black screen. That happened with the first Super4 but I was hoping that the later version would work. I tried Tahr64-605 and, to my great surprise, it booted and seems to run OK, so kernel 3.14.54 is OK on this machine.

However, Tahrpup64 has the same network problem, TEST fails, AutoDHCP works fine. I'll try the latest Super2 next but I'm loosing hope.

On the T400 laptop, I had problems with 3HD. Using Tahr64 and using Frisbee, I suspect that there are still problems. Initially it reports that eth0 is down. Then, it connects with wlan0. After connecting with wlan0, it changes its mind and switches successfully to eth0. I haven't worked out how to shut off the radios on this laptop in Puppy as yet, so I only suspect that its the same problem as my desktop has.

Greengeek, the problem is not just at bootup. Persistent retries in a session always act the same.

Snail
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Upgrading to Latest Sulu2

#502 Post by Snail »

I have been running a very old version of Sulu2. I have just downloaded the latest Sulu2. Is it safe to use my existing save folder?

Snail
Posts: 331
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Re: Strange network connection issue - Upgrading to Latest S

#503 Post by Snail »

Ok, I backed up the sulusave directory and booted the latest Sulu2. It appeared to work with no problems.

Unfortunately, there was no improvement with the network issue. I haven't checked Frisbee, as I appear to be stuck with Dougal's wizard. How do I change that?

Snail
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Re: Strange network connection issue

#504 Post by Snail »

OK, found the network wizard. Got confused by the difference between Tahr and Sulu :? .

I now have Frisbee on both the new Sulu2 and the Tahr64-605 pups on this desktop. They both now connect automatically. The reason is, I think, that whereas Dougal's wizard gave up when it couldn't find eth0 and had to be manually "pushed" to try AutoDHCP, Frisbee keeps on trying.

Running Frisbee, with both Tahr and Sulu, I get and initial pop-up saying eth0 is down. about 15 seconds later I get another pop-up announcing that an attempt to connect is underway and eventually I get the message that 192..etc. has been set-up.

The process can be lived with but it's a bit slow. Previously, before I moved to the wall jack set-up, I never really noticed any delay between the desktop appearing and the network being available. Now it takes nearly 20 seconds with Tahr and somewhat longer for Sulu.

There is another odd thing. Sulu seems to connect to the internet very much more slowly than Tahr. I have made a series of speedtest.net checks. I did a test in Tahr, rebooted and ran a test in Sulu, rebooted to Tahr etc etc. Here are the download speeds:

Tahr ............................ Sulu

91 ............................ --
-- ............................ 51.5
89.2 ............................ --
-- ............................ 47.7
71.7 ............................ --
-- ............................ 21.1
92 ............................ --
-- ............................ 51
91.3 ............................ --
-- ............................ 31.9
90.6 ............................ --
-- ............................ 54.9
71.6

The speed variation is normal for this time of night and probably arises from issues well upstream of my house demarcation point. However,I think that it's pretty clear that for some reason there is a significant difference in favour of Tahr in respect of the speeds.

I could live with even the worst speeds if I had to, compared with ADSL they are still terrific. And with peak speeds over 90 Meg I don't think my wiring can be that bad, considering it's only wired for 100BaseT. So I'm happy. Still, it might be interesting if someone with expertise to was to find all this sufficiently intriguing to try and figure it out.

cthisbear
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Location: Sydney Australia

#505 Post by cthisbear »

" Sulu seems to connect to the internet very much more slowly than Tahr."

Changing your wireless channel may help things connect faster.

Where your modem is located, dimmer switches etc...
all add to wireless connectivity.

Chris.

Snail
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#506 Post by Snail »

Hi cthisbear,

Thanks for your reply. However, this is an ethernet issue, not wifi. See the above several posts.

cthisbear
Posts: 4422
Joined: Sun 29 Jan 2006, 22:07
Location: Sydney Australia

#507 Post by cthisbear »

Boilers, dimmer switches, plasma tvs, all sorts of other issues
can affect adsl.

http://www.internode.on.net/support/gui ... ng_adsl2_/

Also read >> percher...half way down page.
although alaan is usually my favourite.

http://forums.whirlpool.net.au/forum-re ... ?t=2304393

Lamps baby monitors.

" One in five households is suffering from poor Internet connection because their router is placed too close to a lamp, phone, stereo or
baby monitor, the telecoms watchdog warns.

Sharon White, chief executive of Ofcom, says many homes receive a
fast broadband connection through their phone line, only for the
signal to be hit by "interference" on its way to a computer or tablet. "

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/shoppin ... -says.html

Chris.

Snail
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Joined: Sun 18 Oct 2009, 07:32

#508 Post by Snail »

Hi cthisbear,

No ADSL, All fibre from the ISP to the ONT next to my router and cat5e from there to the desktop computer. Also, no boilers, dimmers etc and my wife would go crazy if her AM radio got any interference.

We'd better not hiajck this thread any longer, unless rerwin thinks it worthwhile to investigate.

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greengeek
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#509 Post by greengeek »

Snail wrote:We'd better not hiajck this thread any longer, unless rerwin thinks it worthwhile to investigate.
If rerwin is able to look at it, and if you have the patience to continue testing I think it would be extremely valuable to use this circumstance to troubleshoot exactly what is going on. I have seen lots of ethernet/dhcp connection issues with various puppies in circumstances where windows has no problem so it would be great to pin down whats going on in this case. Any results might have a positive impact across other puppies too.

If you are convinced that the pin to pin wiring is still exactly the same as what it was before then surely it can only be wiring resistance/capacitance/inductance causing problems and if so why can windows hack it but puppy can't?

I would suggest the following steps:
1) Confirm that you can go back to the original conditions - eg no connection problems when you use the original cable straight out of your original router port.
2) See what circumstances you get when you hook into the cabling of other rooms (assuming there are some..)

If you have a reproducible difference in behaviour then maybe rerwin can suggest insertion of a delay command or something, somewhere in the dhcp connection code (or the "TEST" code).

partsman
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Location: OHIO,USA

#510 Post by partsman »

Hi all :D
HI snail
Hello greengeek :wink:
Its been some time since I have posted here ! But with the weather starting to get cold again well ! Boredom is setting in fast LOL ! :lol:

@ snail My 2 cents ! you are lookng at a kernel problem !! "Thats not to say it cant be made better by playing with some of the values in frisbee etc. but :shock: This sounds more like a kernel problem directly effecting your hardware !

In other words what works for one PC may not work for another etc
I personally have found trying to stay with older kernels as much as possable at least as old as I can go and still have decent working hardware !

With this said I am by no meens an expert ! But maybe use a diff version of lucid ! "Diff Kernel" And you may find it works better with your hardware ! Or you could try to build a older or more recent kernel module for your hardware !

However ! I would try a diff lucid " diff kernel" if your able too"
Again ! I am no expert but souds more like what you have goin on to me !

At any rate hope it works out for you one way or another ! Good luck !

And I also wanted to add
@rerwin ! Thanks for keeping lucid alive !!!!!!!! I hope its still fun for you and not a burden !!!! :D :wink:
[color=red]Anyone can build a fast processor. The trick is to build a fast system. (Seymour Cray)[/color] :wink:

keniv
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Joined: Tue 06 Oct 2009, 21:00
Location: Scotland

#511 Post by keniv »

Helo All,
I'm looking for the devx.sfs for lupusuper2-5.2.8.7-k3.2.48. I've tried searching for it but can only find lupu_devx_528-4.sfs. Can anybody point me in the right direction to find it?

Regards,

Ken.
Last edited by keniv on Tue 25 Oct 2016, 11:52, edited 1 time in total.

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ally
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Location: lincoln, uk
Contact:

#512 Post by ally »


keniv
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Joined: Tue 06 Oct 2009, 21:00
Location: Scotland

#513 Post by keniv »

Hello ally,
Thanks for the link. I've just downloaded it.

Regards,

Ken.

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rerwin
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Location: Maine, USA

SeaMonkey 2.40 Update PET Package

#514 Post by rerwin »

For those of you who have not already manually upgraded your installed SeaMonkey, I provide an "update" .pet that performs that upgrade, here:
http://www.mediafire.com/file/9h04txm8e ... update.pet

The package replaces only the /usr/lib/seamonkey directory, leaving anything in /root unchanged, so as to retain your current settings.

Peebee has added 2.40 to the puppylinux/pet_packages-lucid repository at ibiblio.org for use by Quickpet in selecting a SeaMonkey browser. Note that it includes files in /root, so is intended only for initial installation of SeaMonkey. Use the package at the above link if you already have an older SeaMonkey installed.
Richard

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rerwin
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Location: Maine, USA

Content of the 2016 Release of Lucid Pup

#515 Post by rerwin »

Updates for Lucid Pup 2016:
Additions:
  • 8192cu_racy53-k3.0.25.pet (lupusuper1)
    asound_include-0.3 (for potential use by pmusic, pequalizer & puppybt, et. al.) *
    get_java-1.0.1.pet
    gxmessage-2.12.4-1-w5c.pet
    javaif-20160616.pet
    peasy_dvd_player-1.3.pet
    peasyport-2.0.pet
    pequalizer-0.9.0.pet
    psnapshot-1.9
    PupsaveHotBackup-1.4_20150717.pet
    samba-4.1.9-lucid-i686.pet
    YASSM-2.9.pet
Upgrades:
  • alsaequal-0.6-lupu.pet
    connect_updates-20160527.pet (in zz_lupu_5.2.8.7-delta)
    dillo-3.0.5-i486-lucid.pet (user can delete old /root/.dillo directory.)
    Extract-1.8.1-lucid.pet (adds xz support) *
    frisbee-1.4.2.pet - includes frisbee_1.3.4_interface_supplement-20150607
    getflash-1.6.1.pet - updated woofCE version *
    gxmessage-2.12.4-1-w5c.pet *
    lucid_utility_menu_fix-20160902.pet (in zz_lupu_5.2.8.7-delta)
    menumaker-1.1.17.pet
    pburn-4.3.17.pet (from woofCE)
    pdiag-20160508.pet (sourced files updates)
    peasyprint-2.9.pet
    pfilesearch-2.2.pet (from woofCE)
    pfind-6.2-1.pet
    pgprs-2.0.1.pet
    pmusic-5.2.6.pet *
    pprocess-2.3.2 (from woofCE)
    pschedule-1.1.7.pet (from woofCE)
    PupControl-3.1 *
    PupMenu-5.1 *
    pupradio-0.19.pet
    retrovol-0.13.1.pet
    PupSysInfo-2.6.5 *
    sfs_load-2.4-1.pet
    tar-1.28-i686.pet
    wallpaper-0.6.4-lucid.pet
    zz_lupu_5.2.8.7-delta-20161216.pet (puppy infrastructure) *
zz_lupu_5.2.8.7-delta infrastructure updates:
  • /bin/ps.sh - wrapper for ps, linked as ps (formerly ps script) *
    /etc/xdg/menus/puppy-utility.menu (from lucid_utility_menu_fix-20160902)
    /root/.packages/DISTRO_COMPAT_REPOS - update ubuntu archive URLs
    /sbin/dir2sfs - change name of file list script to match new name.
    /sbin/guess_fstype - version from precise pup, to detect ext4.
    /usr/bin/dir2pet - correct search for top category in hierarchy, add xz support.
    /usr/bin/pet2tgz - add xz support.
    /usr/bin/pupdialog - support new/updated package
    /usr/lib/libgnutls.so.28 - link to so.26 for samba 4.1.9
    /usr/local/apps/Connect/AppRun (from connect_updates-20160527)
    /usr/local/bin/zenity - link to yad (fork of zenity)
    /usr/local/desksetup/desksetup.sh - correct PuppyPin check
    /usr/local/lib/X11/mini-icons/mini-Multimedia.xpm - for pmusic
    /usr/local/petget/help.htm *
    /usr/local/petget/installpkg.sh - support xz-compressed pets.
    /usr/local/petget/petget - correct parsing of deb name release; remove temp copy of pet file when not installed
    /usr/local/pup_event/frontend_change - guess_fstype fails sometimes, when no partitions on device.
    /usr/sbin/background_reshape - wjaguar rewrite
    /usr/sbin/connectwizard (from connect_updates-20160527)
    /usr/sbin/connectwizard_2nd (from connect_updates-20160527)
    /usr/sbin/remove_builtin - fix handling of directory links & names with spaces
    /usr/sbin/remaster_package_check - uninstall no-longer-necessary packages & files
    /usr/sbin/variconlinks - add support for .svg icons *
    /usr/share/doc/gtkdialog.txt
    /usr/share/icons/hicolor/32x32/apps/gtkdialog.png
ubuntu deb updates:
  • ca-certificates_20141019ubuntu0.10.04.1_all.deb
    caps_0.4.2-1_i386.deb
    libc6_2.11.1-0ubuntu7.21_i386.deb *
    libc6-dev_2.11.1-0ubuntu7.21_i386.deb *
    libc-bin_2.11.1-0ubuntu7.21_i386.deb *
    libglibmm-2.4-1c2a_2.24.2-0ubuntu1_i386.deb *
    libglibmm-2.4-dev_2.24.2-0ubuntu1_i386.deb *
    libparted0debian1_2.2-5ubuntu5.2_i386.deb
    libpoppler5_0.12.4-0ubuntu5.3_i386.deb
    libpoppler-glib4_0.12.4-0ubuntu5.3_i386.deb
    libssl0.9.8_0.9.8k-7ubuntu8.27_i386.deb
    libssl-dev_0.9.8k-7ubuntu8.27_i386.deb
    openssl_0.9.8k-7ubuntu8.27_i386.deb
    parted_2.2-5ubuntu5.2_i386.deb
    poppler-utils_0.12.4-0ubuntu5.3_i386.deb
    ppp_2.4.5~git20081126t100229-0ubuntu3.1_i386.deb
    procps_3.2.8-1ubuntu4.3_i386.deb
    python2.6_2.6.5-1ubuntu6.3_i386.deb
    python_2.6.5-0ubuntu1.1_all.deb
    python2.6-minimal_2.6.5-1ubuntu6.3_i386.deb
    python-libxml2_2.7.6.dfsg-1ubuntu1.15_i386.deb
    rsync_3.0.7-1ubuntu1.1_i386.deb
    subversion_1.6.6dfsg-2ubuntu1.3_i386.deb
    uuid-dev_2.17.2-0ubuntu1.10.04.2_i386.deb
    wget_1.12-1.1ubuntu2.2_i386.deb
    wpasupplicant_0.6.9-3ubuntu3.2_i386.deb
    x11-xserver-utils_7.5+1ubuntu2.1_i386.deb
    xserver-common_1.7.6-2ubuntu7.12_all.deb
    xserver-xorg-core_1.7.6-2ubuntu7.12_i386.deb
    xserver-xorg-dev_1.7.6-2ubuntu7.12_i386.deb
    xserver-xorg-input-all_7.5+5ubuntu1.1_i386.deb
    xserver-xorg-video-all_7.5+5ubuntu1.1_i386.deb
    xserver-xorg-video-ati_6.13.1-1ubuntu1~xup3~lucid_i386.deb
    xserver-xorg-video-radeon_6.13.1-1ubuntu1~xup3~lucid_i386.deb
* updated later

If you know of an update that I have missed or that you feel should be included, please post a request in this thread.
Richard
Last edited by rerwin on Thu 29 Dec 2016, 04:10, edited 4 times in total.

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