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 Forum index » Advanced Topics » Puppy Projects
Puppy webserver - LOW POWER CONSUMPTION
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Ted Dog


Joined: 13 Sep 2005
Posts: 2534
Location: Heart of Texas

PostPosted: Wed 27 Nov 2013, 13:39    Post_subject:  

mixed battery / mix solar cell systems. I just read that your can charge batteries that are strung in series ACROSS individual batteries with solar and its better for the batteries since series run batterys will always be unbalanced when charged across full string.

my RV is two golf cart 6v and I wonder if my shunt types ( have two, for on the road spare ) can be dropped to 6v. it automatically adjust 24/12 systems. My flex cell solar can put out 4v in full moon not sure of amps Confused so I lost a few hours of amps between battery voltage cutout and that would be high enough to charge @ 6v
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amigo

Joined: 02 Apr 2007
Posts: 2294

PostPosted: Wed 27 Nov 2013, 13:41    Post_subject:  

Quote:
Is puppy just too difficult to set up for this task, or lacking in protocols, or is running as root a bad idea for this purpose?

Basically, yes, yes and yes.

Probably the best thing would be debian stable. You could make nearly any mainstream distro work, after hardening it some, but I'd avoid any LiveCD-based thing, ubuntu and any other desktop-oriented distro. A small cli-only debian or slackware installation would make the best starting point and get in your way the least.
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mikeb


Joined: 23 Nov 2006
Posts: 9061

PostPosted: Wed 27 Nov 2013, 14:04    Post_subject:  

Fair enough... got to work with the technology available at a sensible price. I get stuff mainly from hong kong as its so much cheaper than here.

mike
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greengeek

Joined: 20 Jul 2010
Posts: 2752
Location: New Zealand

PostPosted: Wed 27 Nov 2013, 14:12    Post_subject:  

Ted Dog wrote:
so I lost a few hours of amps between battery voltage cutout and that would be high enough to charge @ 6v
I've had a similar thought myself - it's easier to find charge current for a 6v battery than a 12v one. I have tested stepper motors as a source of easy charge current but the voltage is often no more than 7 or 8 volts which would be fine for 6V batts but not so much use on 12v unless I used something like the joule thief idea.
http://rimstar.org/science_electronics_projects/joule_thief_power_cfl_with_jeannas_light_circuit.htm
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Ted Dog


Joined: 13 Sep 2005
Posts: 2534
Location: Heart of Texas

PostPosted: Wed 27 Nov 2013, 14:55    Post_subject:  

I was hoping to hang 5v running stuff off of one of the 6v batteries. so differental charging is a must. Im looking forward to the coming 3.7v USB3 powered tablets as a real solution. I want to run my mele1000 as a wget downloader and file server wifi access point directly wired to my RV. got to pay for the bandwidth on the road so a outbound webserver would not be ideal.
I also try to avoid maintaining solar cells when on the RV roof, So choice of bigger solar and simple and cheap shunt charge controller (17 $) to keep my equipment happy. Shunt charge controllers are easier to find down under.
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Ted Dog


Joined: 13 Sep 2005
Posts: 2534
Location: Heart of Texas

PostPosted: Wed 27 Nov 2013, 15:06    Post_subject:  

been looking at the jt thingy and found out you cant charge big batteries with such a thing however a buck/boost type IC are getting cheaper than shunt controllers and soon it will be economically a option for mid sized solar setups like ours. It will step up usable amps from as low as 3V to as high as nearly open current voltage of 30v. there is a program able model for gearheads auto computers. but only support 10amps for 80$.
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greengeek

Joined: 20 Jul 2010
Posts: 2752
Location: New Zealand

PostPosted: Wed 27 Nov 2013, 17:44    Post_subject:  

Do you know what it is about the Mele that allows it to automatically boot itself back up after power fail? Thats a real handy feature.
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greengeek

Joined: 20 Jul 2010
Posts: 2752
Location: New Zealand

PostPosted: Wed 27 Nov 2013, 17:54    Post_subject:  

amigo wrote:
Probably the best thing would be debian stable. You could make nearly any mainstream distro work, after hardening it some,
Sickgut was quite focused on the server side of things. His first post regarding Pussy Linux mentions headless server use. Given my relative lack of experience with Linux outside of the puppy forums I would appreciate any comments you might have regarding sickgut's projects as a possible starting point:
http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=69475
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Ted Dog


Joined: 13 Sep 2005
Posts: 2534
Location: Heart of Texas

PostPosted: Wed 27 Nov 2013, 18:21    Post_subject:  

greengeek wrote:
Do you know what it is about the Mele that allows it to automatically boot itself back up after power fail? Thats a real handy feature.


more like the power is hardwired as the on when power applied. There is a button to turn it OFF but it is really still running as a remote button press turns it back on..... and It does not have to be its own remote. The TV and cable remotes also trigger it back alive!!! it is a handy way to tell if power loss occured while away from RV when its plugged into 120v.
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p310don

Joined: 19 May 2009
Posts: 746
Location: Brisbane, Australia

PostPosted: Thu 28 Nov 2013, 19:02    Post_subject:  

This:
[url]
http://208.109.22.214/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=80474&sid=94dc3487dce5b656b268a2ede234d88d[/url]

Running on a netbook.

Webserver already done. Netbook, low power usage, especially with an SSD. If sunlight is low, netbooks will often go for up to 10 hours, needed for overnight.
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Volhout


Joined: 28 Dec 2008
Posts: 418

PostPosted: Fri 29 Nov 2013, 10:25    Post_subject: netbook and energy consumption  

Replacing the netbook harddisk with an ssd won't save you that much power. The stack would be relatively small so the rest of the 1Gbyte of RAM can be used as a largefile system. Harddisk access would be hardly needed.

It saves far more if you can disable the video chip in the netbook (bios?). Backlight off is also a nice, but minor contributer.

If you want something in the "sub 3 watt" class, go for the RP. Netbooks won't get you there easy. And hacking up the motherboard of a netbook is far too risky.

You may want to look for single board computers with an atom N270, and NO graphics chip. Then you are in the 5 watt class, with reasonable performance (slacko will run fine).

Volhout.
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greengeek

Joined: 20 Jul 2010
Posts: 2752
Location: New Zealand

PostPosted: Fri 29 Nov 2013, 15:06    Post_subject:  

p310don wrote:
http://208.109.22.214/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=80474&sid=94dc3487dce5b656b268a2ede234d88d
Thanks, I will add that link trail to my first post for reference. Towards the end of the webserver puppy thread Atle makes a comment about webserverpuppy being a bit old now. Is he correct? Is it unsafe now? (can puppy ever be safe as a webserver...)
http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=43285&start=128
Do people agree with his comment that Hiawatha is a valuable base for a webserver?
Would Hiawatha still be valuable if I decide a non-puppy solution is best?

Volhout wrote:
You may want to look for single board computers with an atom N270, and NO graphics chip. Then you are in the 5 watt class, with reasonable performance
Would that be a commonly available mini-itx type of board or more of an industrial build for embedded applications? (Just trying to think where I would look for such a thing...). How would such a board drive a gui based OS? Would they have to have HDMI video output or would they be driven via network interface remote desktop somehow? (or just network based cli??)
Edited_time_total
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Moose On The Loose


Joined: 24 Feb 2011
Posts: 547

PostPosted: Fri 29 Nov 2013, 16:12    Post_subject:  

Ted Dog wrote:
mixed battery / mix solar cell systems. I just read that your can charge batteries that are strung in series ACROSS individual batteries with solar and its better for the batteries since series run batterys will always be unbalanced when charged across full string.



Doing it cell by cell is the absolute best. With lead acid, at least, you can do it with a string of Schottky diodes and capacitors and do it from a common AC source.

I've build the version with 2 12V batteries making 24V and one controller in the distant past.
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Q5sys


Joined: 11 Dec 2008
Posts: 1074

PostPosted: Mon 16 Dec 2013, 00:38    Post_subject:  

greengeek...
If you've got an RPi lying around...
Take this and just build on top of it.
http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=90788

Its a debian wheezy puppy + nginx + php-fpm

I'm planning an x86 version when Im sure its stable.
So a basic x86 Puppy/Server is in the pipeline

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greengeek

Joined: 20 Jul 2010
Posts: 2752
Location: New Zealand

PostPosted: Mon 16 Dec 2013, 04:18    Post_subject:  

Interesting. Thanks Q5. I don't have a Pi yet - I was going to get one last year then I saw all the power problems people were having so I shelved the idea. It does look like a suitable piece of hardware for this sort of low power application though, assuming I can get one of the later versions.

Have you measured the current draw while your Pi is running the server image?
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