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 Forum index » Advanced Topics » Puppy Projects
DebianDog - beta changed to stable version
Moderators: Flash, JohnMurga
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fredx181

Joined: 11 Dec 2013
Posts: 676
Location: holland

PostPosted: Thu 08 May 2014, 13:06    Post subject:  

dancytron wrote:
fredx181 wrote:

*stuff deleted*

Does a DebianDog that's using a save file during a session, normally auto-save during the session?
Yes, but only if you setup correctly "changes=EXIT:/<path>/changes.dat" you can do from terminal:
Code:
save2flash

That will save in the middle of a session.

*more stuff deleted*

Fred


Will this work with Porteus style boot with changes kept in a folder configured to save only on exit.


Yes, it's the same.

Fred
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dancytron

Joined: 18 Jul 2012
Posts: 258

PostPosted: Thu 08 May 2014, 13:10    Post subject:  

Thanks. Just tested it and it worked great for me. I'd document this up front (if you haven't already and I just missed it).

Keep up the good work.

Dan
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Billtoo


Joined: 07 Apr 2009
Posts: 2057
Location: Ontario Canada

PostPosted: Thu 08 May 2014, 21:56    Post subject: DebianDog - beta version.  

Running on an emachines D620 laptop:
Computer
Processor AMD Athlon(tm) Processor 2650e
Memory 1813MB (152MB used)
Operating System Debian GNU/Linux 7.2
User Name root (root)
Date/Time Thu May 8 19:27:45 2014
Display
Resolution 1280x800 pixels
Vendor The X.Org Foundation
Version 1.12.4
OpenGL
Vendor X.Org R300 Project
Renderer Gallium 0.4 on ATI RS690
Version 2.1 Mesa 8.0.5
Direct Rendering Yes

I installed several applications with synaptic and apt-get including
iceweasel,xbmc,kpat,kshisen,kmahjongg,lxterminal,midnight commander,and more.
It's working well so far but I have lots more to learn about using Debian
Dog.
screenshot.jpg
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screenshot.jpg

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saintless


Joined: 11 Jun 2011
Posts: 2213
Location: Bulgaria

PostPosted: Fri 09 May 2014, 01:58    Post subject:  

Hi, Billtoo.

Unfortunately running different linux version is like learning linux again even for experienced users. Debian behaviour is different from Puppy. Special DebianDog programs information here:
http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=93391
Everything else is as running Debian Wheezy. You can easy upgrade to testing or unstable or use it as standard Debian Wheezy full install.

DebianDog is a base to make it larger or smaller. Removing packages with all dependencies from the system before remaster is as easy as adding packages. In fact you can reverse DebianDog to basic command prompt system with working apt-get but without Xorg, WM and any GUI programs very easy and start building from this point what ever you wish. Maybe I will explain how to do this in HowTo thread later.

Toni

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mcewanw

Joined: 16 Aug 2007
Posts: 2252
Location: New Zealand

PostPosted: Fri 09 May 2014, 02:29    Post subject:  

The way you have assembled the install information and howtos in just a thread or two, but near the top of each, is really great Toni. We have the advantage of this being a new creation. Puppy has been around so long that information is all over the place so although it eventually becomes very familiar it can take a long time to master it all. I find it doesn't take long at all to become relatively comfortable with Debian, though mastery is another matter of course.

You clearly learned a lot working with FoxyRoxy. This page is very informative from there:

http://foxyroxylinux.com/viewforum.php?f=20&sid=41745b88846307ac155e4fcffa3af3a6

Particularly:
Quote:
dpkg = the unsung hero while apt-get receives all the glory

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saintless


Joined: 11 Jun 2011
Posts: 2213
Location: Bulgaria

PostPosted: Fri 09 May 2014, 03:28    Post subject:  

mcewanw wrote:
You clearly learned a lot working with FoxyRoxy. This page is very informative from there:

http://foxyroxylinux.com/viewforum.php?f=20&sid=41745b88846307ac155e4fcffa3af3a6

Yes, I learned a lot from JBV and FoxyRoxyLinux project. Many DebianDog scripts are ideas included as cli scripts in FoxyRoxyLinux from JBV. Zero-sizing man/doc/info files is JBV's idea for example as also all dpkg-update stuff included in separate kernel modules for DebianDog.

Toni

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Sylvander

Joined: 15 Dec 2008
Posts: 3400
Location: West Lothian, Scotland, UK

PostPosted: Fri 09 May 2014, 05:37    Post subject:  

@saintless
1. Working my way back through the thread, post-by-post looking for things I aught to do [to complete the following of all instructions].

2. See THIS POST by you.
I've completed nearly all of this, so as to get to the point where I have an XFE window displaying the content of the changes.dat save file.

3. "it is recommended to delete the content of save file which is not in use running DebianDog with No-Save boot option
Er...
Right now I'm running in DebianDog having used the boot option to make use of the changes.dat file in the /mnt/live/mnt/sda5/05-DebianDog folder.
So what should I do now?
I'm guessing I should:
a. Reboot with the new [config+file] changes saved.
b. Boot with the "no save file" option chosen.
c. Again follow your instructions so as to be able to delete ALL of the content of the save file. [all of the previously made/saved changes will then be gone]
d. Reboot, and boot in using the save file this time.
e. Repeat the following of your instructions.
This time the changes made will be going into [added to] a save file that is empty.
f. At shutdown/reboot those new changes will be the only content of the save file, yes? Can you confirm?

4. Now back here in "no save file" mode.
a. Deleted ALL content in /media/+media+sda5+05-DebianDog+changes.dat
Will now reboot into "use save file" mode.

b. Back in "save file" mode. [I hope; beginning to lose track]
Hmm, having repeated your instructions there is lots of content displayed in the /media/+mnt+live+mnt+sda5+05-DebianDog+changes.dat file.
I will leave as-is and wait for your further instructions.

c. Will reboot into "save file" mode to see if the changes are present [permanent].

5. Back yet again in "save file" mode.
a. "XFE->cnahges.dat->Properties->File Assiciations-> In Open (white field) type there mnt-img->click Accept button"
This change hasn't been saved! i.e. It isn't permanent. Not persisting to every "save file" session.
Should it be permanent?
Ah, having rebooted a couple of times in "save file" mode, and made the change, it is now permanent [see 5c below].

b. I'll move an icon [its location on the desktop] and see if it is still in that location when I come back in using "save file".
Back in, and the icon is still located where it was placed, so that's OK. Very Happy

c. Checked "XFE->cnahges.dat->Properties->File Assiciations-> In Open (white field)", and "mnt-img" is there [permanent], so that's OK.

6.
I notice:
a. When booting into "save file" mode, it's reported that the save file wasn't dismounted cleanly at previous shutdown.

b. The firewall [Firehol] is disable in "etc/default/firehol".
I've just now edited the content of that file so it now looks thus:
Code:
#To enable firehol at startup set START_FIREHOL=YES
START_FIREHOL=YES
#If you want to have firehol wait for an iface to be up add it here
WAIT_FOR_IFACE=""

i.e. I changed START_FIREHOL=NO to START_FIREHOL=YES.
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saintless


Joined: 11 Jun 2011
Posts: 2213
Location: Bulgaria

PostPosted: Fri 09 May 2014, 09:22    Post subject:  

Hi, Sylvander.
Sylvander wrote:
2. See THIS POST by you.

You really can make something simple to be very complicated Smile
My post is a reply to your question how to delete files from save file.
Fred gave you the command line option how to mount from terminal and delete files from it. Or to use new created empty save file.http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=776173#776173
I gave you single click mount option for changes.dat to delete or add files inside without need to type commands in terminal. Nothing more and I have no further instructions on this. Use new mnt-img or don't use it. Attached mnt-img was edited special for you as answer to:
Quote:
I've never deleted the contents of a savefile before!

To give you option to do it easy. I do not ask why you need to delete files from changes.dat I just gave you easy way to do it.

About firewall I will write again - I can't give you good advice how to configure firehol. The configuration file is /etc/firehol/firehol.cfg but I can't tell what is the proper configuration.

Toni

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Sylvander

Joined: 15 Dec 2008
Posts: 3400
Location: West Lothian, Scotland, UK

PostPosted: Fri 09 May 2014, 09:53    Post subject:  

1. "You really can make something simple to be very complicated"
Ouch!
a. I prefer to do it visually by left-clicking on /mnt/live/mnt/sda5/05-DebianDog/changes.dat within Xfe, because I can get my mind around what is going on, SEE which file I'm opening, and SEE the folder/file contents of that save file.
I might then explore, and get to know and understand the layout/structure of the folder/file contents.
If I then used Xfe to delete some [or all] of the contents of the save file [the save file must NOT be in use at that moment] I could SEE it happening.
I find this easy to do once I get my mind around what is going on, and I think I'm at that point now.
I was taught MANY years ago that people in general learn/understand MUCH MORE of what they SEE rather than from words/text [an image is worth a thousand words].
I rate "understanding" very highly ["with all thy getting get understanding"].
I generally don't forget the principles of those things I come to understand, even if I forget the detail.

b. Although I can copy&paste commands into a terminal, and I'm happy to do that...
At this present time, I'm not comfortable with using commands to get stuff done.
I wouldn't be certain of what was going on, and would be unable to know whether such things were happening as they aught.
I'd be crossing my fingers and hoping, and that's not a way I like to work.
Like they say:
"crossing your fingers is the worst form of family planning".
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Billtoo


Joined: 07 Apr 2009
Posts: 2057
Location: Ontario Canada

PostPosted: Fri 09 May 2014, 10:23    Post subject:  

Sylvander wrote:
/changes.dat within Xfe, because I can get my mind around what is going on, SEE which file I'm opening, and SEE the folder/file contents of that save file.
I might then explore, and get to know and understand the layout/structure of the folder/file contents.
If I then used Xfe to delete some [or all] of the contents of the save file [the save file must NOT be in use at that moment] I could SEE it happening.
I find this easy to do once I get my mind around what is going on, and I think I'm at that point now.


Here's my changes.dat in xfe, I don't want to delete anything but would like to make it larger than 2gb, it's getting close to full with only 200mb of space left.
changes.jpg
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saintless


Joined: 11 Jun 2011
Posts: 2213
Location: Bulgaria

PostPosted: Fri 09 May 2014, 10:46    Post subject:  

Hi, Billtoo.

First try:
Code:
apt-get clean

This will remove all downloaded deb packages from /var/cache/apt/archives. You do not need these packages after installing them. This will give you more free space.
Here is testing version of GUI script for resizing save file (not ready for public use yet but it works):
http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=775613#775613
Boot with no-save option (always fresh for example) and use it only for changes.dat that is not mounted. The man page of resize2fs command says it can also enlarge save file that is mounted (in use) but it is not tested proper yet.

Or use this from command line after boot with no-save file boot code:
Check for errors, resize for example from 2Gb to 3Gb and check for errors again:
Code:
e2fsck /path-to/changes.dat
resize2fs -f /path-to/changes.dat 3000M
e2fsck /path-to/changes.dat


Toni

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Billtoo


Joined: 07 Apr 2009
Posts: 2057
Location: Ontario Canada

PostPosted: Fri 09 May 2014, 10:56    Post subject:  

Doing apt-get clean got 400mb of space back, I'll leave it at that for now.
Thanks
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fredx181

Joined: 11 Dec 2013
Posts: 676
Location: holland

PostPosted: Fri 09 May 2014, 13:30    Post subject:  

Sylvander wrote:
1. "You really can make something simple to be very complicated"
Ouch!

I agree with Toni:
You put a lot of efford in writing your posts as clear/detailed as possible, but IMHO it's overdone.
It's the opposite of someone only just saying: "Doesn't work, what should I do?"
Keep it simple, your posts look like a complicated Howto.
I also think: correct me if I'm wrong, that you have already experience using puppy and all things how to use a savefile.
It's very similar on DebianDog, specially when using the porteus-boot way.

Fred
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saintless


Joined: 11 Jun 2011
Posts: 2213
Location: Bulgaria

PostPosted: Fri 09 May 2014, 13:57    Post subject:  

Resize Save File GUI utility here. Will be included in the next version.
http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?p=776350#776350

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mcewanw

Joined: 16 Aug 2007
Posts: 2252
Location: New Zealand

PostPosted: Fri 09 May 2014, 17:48    Post subject:  

fredx181 wrote:
Sylvander wrote:
1. "You really can make something simple to be very complicated"
Ouch!

I agree with Toni:
You put a lot of efford in writing your posts as clear/detailed as possible, but IMHO it's overdone.
It's the opposite of someone only just saying: "Doesn't work, what should I do?"
Keep it simple, your posts look like a complicated Howto.


Yes, I was feeling the same. I had never used Debian-based systems before but have been using Puppy for years and I found Toni's explanations very simple and clear. Please keep help requests simple. If trying to do complex things above simple remastering it's probably best to just use basic DebianDog install for a while until comfortable with that and basic Debian way of doing things.

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